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<blockquote data-quote="Benimoto" data-source="post: 4045208" data-attributes="member: 40093">Well the whole reach thing breaks down in the fact that creatures with larger than 10 foot reach don't get the extra squares that creatures with 10-foot reach get.And, on a separate point, for those advocating the 2 movement, 3 diagonal system, you'll notice that for any movement with an even number of movement points, you're really going with something similar to a 2-1-2-1 diagonal system instead of the present 1-2-1-2 system.&nbsp; This creates some weird problems when you try to use the system for things like reach or spell radius.In fact, using the 2 straight, 3 diagonal system, or any system that penalizes the first diagonal, you'll notice the first weird effect with creatures that have 5 foot reach, like basically everybody.&nbsp; If you consider 5 feet equal to two distance points, a creature with 5 foot reach can't even attack diagonally, since that's three distance points away.&nbsp; You also lose the ability to take a 5-foot step diagonally.&nbsp; I would consider that a weird effect.And for all the people still complaining about the &quot;diagonal dodge&quot;, notice what Shoe said earlier:He's pretty much confirming that moving and charging in 4th edition works similarly or the same as it works in the DDM rules.&nbsp; That is:Move up to your speed = move actionShift (5 foot step) = move actionAny kind of attack = attack actionCharge (move up to your speed and standard melee attack) = attack actionYou can, of course, use your attack action to take a second move action.&nbsp; Charging no longer has to be in a straight line, and isn't stopped by difficult terrain or allies anymore.So, most of the examples where the creature can only move 30 feet and then attack just don't apply to 4th edition.&nbsp; The range that creatures can attack from dramatically increases, and defenders have to be way more active, engaging threats and pinning them down, than passive.&nbsp; Just standing in the way won't work no matter what movement system you use.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Benimoto, post: 4045208, member: 40093"] Well the whole reach thing breaks down in the fact that creatures with larger than 10 foot reach don't get the extra squares that creatures with 10-foot reach get. And, on a separate point, for those advocating the 2 movement, 3 diagonal system, you'll notice that for any movement with an even number of movement points, you're really going with something similar to a 2-1-2-1 diagonal system instead of the present 1-2-1-2 system. This creates some weird problems when you try to use the system for things like reach or spell radius. In fact, using the 2 straight, 3 diagonal system, or any system that penalizes the first diagonal, you'll notice the first weird effect with creatures that have 5 foot reach, like basically everybody. If you consider 5 feet equal to two distance points, a creature with 5 foot reach can't even attack diagonally, since that's three distance points away. You also lose the ability to take a 5-foot step diagonally. I would consider that a weird effect. And for all the people still complaining about the "diagonal dodge", notice what Shoe said earlier: He's pretty much confirming that moving and charging in 4th edition works similarly or the same as it works in the DDM rules. That is: Move up to your speed = move action Shift (5 foot step) = move action Any kind of attack = attack action Charge (move up to your speed and standard melee attack) = attack action You can, of course, use your attack action to take a second move action. Charging no longer has to be in a straight line, and isn't stopped by difficult terrain or allies anymore. So, most of the examples where the creature can only move 30 feet and then attack just don't apply to 4th edition. The range that creatures can attack from dramatically increases, and defenders have to be way more active, engaging threats and pinning them down, than passive. Just standing in the way won't work no matter what movement system you use. [/QUOTE]

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