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<blockquote data-quote="AFGNCAAP" data-source="post: 1230235" data-attributes="member: 871"><p>The Norse mythology is an odd thing, since there is a concern about how "original" the current material is. There is a concern of the impact of Christianity on the myths, whether in their later development or in their recording. In a way, myth and belief is just as malleable and dynamic as language.</p><p></p><p>Here's an interesting thing about Norse myth--lingusitically, "Tyr" is related to "Indra" and "Zeus," all of which can be traced back to the Indo-European word "Dyaus-Pitar" (IIRC): basically "Sky Father" or "Divine Father," IIRC. However, what we have today is the figure of Thor being more of a sky-father figure rather than Tyr--it is Thor who wields the thunderbolt and slays the serpent, and is a god with a wild demeanor.</p><p></p><p>Along the same lines, the days of the week reflect the relationships between the gods (at 1 time), and how those deities were compared to their Roman equivalents. Thor was equivalent to Jupiter/Jove; Woden/Odin was equal to Mercury; Tyr was equal to Mars; and Freya/Frigga was equal to Venus.</p><p></p><p>IIRC, Tyr originally was the supreme god, whose role (and maybe aspects) were taken over by Thor. Thor was then ousted as the main god by Odin. Coincidentally, Odin had virtues (and dealt with domains) that were valued by the noble classes--he was a king's god. Thor remained the common man's god, controlling the aspects and possessing virutes valued by the folk. Tyr became a war god, and seems to have vanished from the tales altogether (just a the Fenris myth and a mention in Ragnarok, IIRC). I think the ascendence of Odin had to do with the changes in Scandinavia from a land of many small nations(tribes, if youy will), to large nations united under a single, powerful king. While there probably were a vast multitude of Thor-tales amongst the folk, only many of the Odin-tales were recorded, since those were told to those who could ensure and afford them to be written down.</p><p></p><p>As mentioned before, Loki slowly transforms from a Trickster to the Adversary--since he has oft been linked with fire, then this can be somewhat understandable (flames flicker and change shape, thus Loki is a shapeshifter; fire can be beneficial by providing warmth and light, but uncontrolled it can be destructive; thus Loki is a treacherous/dangerous ally). Also, Loki's relationship to the gods seems to vary--at one point, he is 1 of the gods responsible for creating life (alongside Odin; as Lodur, IIRC), whereas in other cases, he is more of an oathsworn ally/brother to Odin (and not a son of Odin, as Loki is depicted in the Thor comic).</p><p></p><p>If anything, the best guess about Tyr is that many of his stories were usurped by other gods. His role as a primary storm/sky-god was taken by Thor. Odin probably took the role of chief of the gods and creator with his ascendence (possibly aspects that Thor took from Tyr, which Odin took from Thor).</p><p></p><p>It's sad that the Norse myths weren't captured/recorded at an earlier time, when they would have been in their heyday (or in a more original/uninfluenced form). It would have been interesting to see what they once were like.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AFGNCAAP, post: 1230235, member: 871"] The Norse mythology is an odd thing, since there is a concern about how "original" the current material is. There is a concern of the impact of Christianity on the myths, whether in their later development or in their recording. In a way, myth and belief is just as malleable and dynamic as language. Here's an interesting thing about Norse myth--lingusitically, "Tyr" is related to "Indra" and "Zeus," all of which can be traced back to the Indo-European word "Dyaus-Pitar" (IIRC): basically "Sky Father" or "Divine Father," IIRC. However, what we have today is the figure of Thor being more of a sky-father figure rather than Tyr--it is Thor who wields the thunderbolt and slays the serpent, and is a god with a wild demeanor. Along the same lines, the days of the week reflect the relationships between the gods (at 1 time), and how those deities were compared to their Roman equivalents. Thor was equivalent to Jupiter/Jove; Woden/Odin was equal to Mercury; Tyr was equal to Mars; and Freya/Frigga was equal to Venus. IIRC, Tyr originally was the supreme god, whose role (and maybe aspects) were taken over by Thor. Thor was then ousted as the main god by Odin. Coincidentally, Odin had virtues (and dealt with domains) that were valued by the noble classes--he was a king's god. Thor remained the common man's god, controlling the aspects and possessing virutes valued by the folk. Tyr became a war god, and seems to have vanished from the tales altogether (just a the Fenris myth and a mention in Ragnarok, IIRC). I think the ascendence of Odin had to do with the changes in Scandinavia from a land of many small nations(tribes, if youy will), to large nations united under a single, powerful king. While there probably were a vast multitude of Thor-tales amongst the folk, only many of the Odin-tales were recorded, since those were told to those who could ensure and afford them to be written down. As mentioned before, Loki slowly transforms from a Trickster to the Adversary--since he has oft been linked with fire, then this can be somewhat understandable (flames flicker and change shape, thus Loki is a shapeshifter; fire can be beneficial by providing warmth and light, but uncontrolled it can be destructive; thus Loki is a treacherous/dangerous ally). Also, Loki's relationship to the gods seems to vary--at one point, he is 1 of the gods responsible for creating life (alongside Odin; as Lodur, IIRC), whereas in other cases, he is more of an oathsworn ally/brother to Odin (and not a son of Odin, as Loki is depicted in the Thor comic). If anything, the best guess about Tyr is that many of his stories were usurped by other gods. His role as a primary storm/sky-god was taken by Thor. Odin probably took the role of chief of the gods and creator with his ascendence (possibly aspects that Thor took from Tyr, which Odin took from Thor). It's sad that the Norse myths weren't captured/recorded at an earlier time, when they would have been in their heyday (or in a more original/uninfluenced form). It would have been interesting to see what they once were like. [/QUOTE]
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