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Not Railroad, Not Sandbox ... What else is there?
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<blockquote data-quote="Torranocca" data-source="post: 8579592" data-attributes="member: 7035401"><p>Let me provide you with an easy to digest example. So let me start by stating I have a first rule to DMing that I share with my players. I will never tell a player “no, you cannot have your character try something. However if you believe what you’re about to try it’s more than likely going to lead to your characters immediate death,it’s probably because it is. In other words I don’t say no you can’t do that.</p><p>Now a good example of this in real game action.</p><p>Player created a lawful good paladin character and almost immediately became fixated on the idea of obtaining a holy avenger sword. Not too surprisingly, it is unwise to hand a first level character that sort of a powerful item to start off with. The player character then tried to obtain one through petitioning the High Cleric of the church he belonged to. He was told he could earn such a blessed item through accumulated merit and not something the church could buy for him, he would have to earn it. He was also told he would have to have a Mastercrafted sword to be able to receive the blessings and rituals that create a Holy Avenger.(sounds like a cool quest, yes?)</p><p>Now here’s actually what the player did:</p><p>First the character took all of their starting money, which wasn’t very much of couse,to the local swordsmith and commissioned a mastercrafted sword using his starter money as a down payment. The character was told by the weapon Smith that he needed three weeks to construct the sword.</p><p>The player/ character then convinced the rest of the party to stall for three weeks (in game time not real time, while lying to them why they were waiting )until the sword was finished. Made no attempt to earn the money needed to pay for said sword, because as you can imagine it was ridiculously expensive for a first level character to afford.</p><p>Lawful Good Palidin then sneaks to the WeaponSmith’s shop in the middle of the night, tries to break in, alerts the Weapon Smiths guard dog, kills said guard dog and wakes up half the neighborhood with the commotion. LG Palidin then breaks into the shop and steals the sword he had commissioned. The weapon Smith then sends his son to run out and get the night watch……..wait for it ….:can you see what’s coming?</p><p>The night watch confront the paladin while he’s walking down the street with the stolen sword in hand and said lawful good paladin immediately attacks them, when they try to arrest him.</p><p>The rest of the story should be pretty obvious, paladin kills a couple guards gets subdued, arrested ,tried, stripped of his title and hung.</p><p>You may be surprised to learn that the player of this character was completely shocked by the outcome and begged the rest of the party to rescue his character. Meanwhile, the rest of his parties players are left scratching their heads as to why he would’ve done any of these things.</p><p>Now you could easily blame me as the DM for not telling the player they shouldn’t or couldn’t do these things, but sadly this is only one example of many times I have seen what player characters will do when you give them a “ sandbox “to play in.</p><p>This is not an example of “ look at this dumb/ bad role player “ he was neither. He just believed in the fallacy that the player is number one and the game is all about them and what they want.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Torranocca, post: 8579592, member: 7035401"] Let me provide you with an easy to digest example. So let me start by stating I have a first rule to DMing that I share with my players. I will never tell a player “no, you cannot have your character try something. However if you believe what you’re about to try it’s more than likely going to lead to your characters immediate death,it’s probably because it is. In other words I don’t say no you can’t do that. Now a good example of this in real game action. Player created a lawful good paladin character and almost immediately became fixated on the idea of obtaining a holy avenger sword. Not too surprisingly, it is unwise to hand a first level character that sort of a powerful item to start off with. The player character then tried to obtain one through petitioning the High Cleric of the church he belonged to. He was told he could earn such a blessed item through accumulated merit and not something the church could buy for him, he would have to earn it. He was also told he would have to have a Mastercrafted sword to be able to receive the blessings and rituals that create a Holy Avenger.(sounds like a cool quest, yes?) Now here’s actually what the player did: First the character took all of their starting money, which wasn’t very much of couse,to the local swordsmith and commissioned a mastercrafted sword using his starter money as a down payment. The character was told by the weapon Smith that he needed three weeks to construct the sword. The player/ character then convinced the rest of the party to stall for three weeks (in game time not real time, while lying to them why they were waiting )until the sword was finished. Made no attempt to earn the money needed to pay for said sword, because as you can imagine it was ridiculously expensive for a first level character to afford. Lawful Good Palidin then sneaks to the WeaponSmith’s shop in the middle of the night, tries to break in, alerts the Weapon Smiths guard dog, kills said guard dog and wakes up half the neighborhood with the commotion. LG Palidin then breaks into the shop and steals the sword he had commissioned. The weapon Smith then sends his son to run out and get the night watch……..wait for it ….:can you see what’s coming? The night watch confront the paladin while he’s walking down the street with the stolen sword in hand and said lawful good paladin immediately attacks them, when they try to arrest him. The rest of the story should be pretty obvious, paladin kills a couple guards gets subdued, arrested ,tried, stripped of his title and hung. You may be surprised to learn that the player of this character was completely shocked by the outcome and begged the rest of the party to rescue his character. Meanwhile, the rest of his parties players are left scratching their heads as to why he would’ve done any of these things. Now you could easily blame me as the DM for not telling the player they shouldn’t or couldn’t do these things, but sadly this is only one example of many times I have seen what player characters will do when you give them a “ sandbox “to play in. This is not an example of “ look at this dumb/ bad role player “ he was neither. He just believed in the fallacy that the player is number one and the game is all about them and what they want. [/QUOTE]
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