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Message: <blockquote data-quote="JohnLynch" data-source="post: 7686985" data-attributes="member: 6749563">I'm pretty sure I'm the only one, so here's how I've been handling it.One group is trying to stealth and the other group is unaware of them (from memory it was the NPCs who succeeded). The players were going up to an obvious ambush spot so the players actively rolled. The NPCs succeeded on their stealth rolls against all but 1 PC.Everyone rolled initiative. Those who were surprised did not get to act in the first round (no-one had reactions so the question of reactions didn't come up), everyone was surprised until the end of the first round.This is supported by the rules.None of this says when surprise ends. You can assume that it ends on a character's turn. However you can also assume it ends after the first round of combat.As per the rulesAs the DM I determine who is surprised. For example if this were at a dinner table among people who are believed to be unarmed and on friendly terms, I would certainly rule that yes, surprise is possible in this scenario. If the player tried to draw a sheathed dagger without being seen I might use a Dexterity (Stealth) roll (as the PHB says to) but to be honest I would probably go for a Dexterity (Sleight of Hand). Alternatively if there is no reason for anyone to suspect that the PC is going to be violent then I might require a Charisma (Deception) vs Wisdom (Insight) check and give the PC advantage. A single PC can also surprise their own party and I would require them to make Wisdom (Insight) checks assuming the PC is not trying to signal his fellow players first (that would be a stealth check opposed by Wisdom (Perception) checks). Whether or not the other players had advantage to determine their fellow PC is suddenly about to do violence would depend on whether that PC had a history of randomly attacking people.Technically the rules on surprise don't support this but I feel it falls under "The DM determines who might be surprised." Now if a group of armed strangers happen to meet in the middle of the wilderness then there's going to need to be significant work done to put the NPCs at ease so that the PC has the ability to declare a surprise attack. Simply talking for a couple of minutes and then yelling "Fireball" isn't going to cut it. Again this is supported by the rules which say</blockquote>

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