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NPC Ability Checks and Stunting or...Ogre Smash
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<blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 7004557" data-attributes="member: 6785785"><p>I suppose for DMs or players who have such experience, having this happen may have more implications. But for most folks....who cares what real world mechanics go into uprooting a tree? I would think that most players don't really care. </p><p></p><p>And I don't know if the maneuver in question on the part of the ogre must require the tree to be fully uprooted. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I suppose. The last of those seems a bit slanted, though, no? Wouldn't "such a feat is beyond a creature of medium size" or similar explanation be a bit more fitting? Again, there are things in the game world that the PCs cannot achieve in any game. Certainly if a PC said "I want to breath fire like that dragon did to us" you wouldn't say "you're not special enough" (Yes, a dragonborn PC can do it, but I think you understand my point). </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Lack of such a baseline knowledge or expectation could be a concern. I don't know if I agree that it would lead to the actual mechanical abilities losing value. I mean, the DM is there to let them know if something is impossible or possible, and if possible if a check is required. That doesn't really change. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I don't really follow this one. But if you mean that a player may complain that the ogre didn't have to make a STR check to knock down the tree, then I would say, as I have above in previous comments, that I would indeed establish some kind of house rule to address such concerns, i.e. Large creatures having advantage on STR checks or something similar. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, I don't really think this is very concerning. Because ultimately, those bad guys doing such threatening things? They lost to the PCs. </p><p></p><p>For me, it's about creating a dynamic encounter for the PCs to face and hopefully overcome rather than about faithfully simulating real world physics. Because that's an impossibility at some point, no matter what. The system breaks down eventually, no matter how strictly it's applied....so I just decide to only apply it where it is needed. </p><p></p><p>Also, I am not saying that you cannot allow PCs to attempt cool actions. Let them if that's what makes them excited to play. Because I said one thing was beyond the PCs does not mean all things are. Whatever idea my PCs come up with, I at least consider. But I think the whole "say yes" is meant as a guideline, not as an absolute. There are certain things the PCs cannot do....so sometimes you have to say no. However, I'm more than willing to give all but the most outlandish and farfetched of ideas a chance. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sure, why not? A PC who has been Enlarged can do what the ogre can, too. I wouldn't have a problem with that. Why would I? What's to be gained by not letting that happen? Preservation of some semblance of real world physics? Meh. </p><p></p><p>I think if I compare the two scenarios....where an ogre and a magically enlarged paladin are knocking trees over at each other, and another where we stop the game to see if it's even possible, and then with a failure the ogre or the PC has wasted their turn.....I prefer the first scenario. </p><p></p><p>There are already many ways in which NPCs, in particular monster NPCs, are designed and function differently than PCs that I don't really see an issue with this. My goal is to keep things moving at the table, and for things to be exciting and dynamic.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="hawkeyefan, post: 7004557, member: 6785785"] I suppose for DMs or players who have such experience, having this happen may have more implications. But for most folks....who cares what real world mechanics go into uprooting a tree? I would think that most players don't really care. And I don't know if the maneuver in question on the part of the ogre must require the tree to be fully uprooted. I suppose. The last of those seems a bit slanted, though, no? Wouldn't "such a feat is beyond a creature of medium size" or similar explanation be a bit more fitting? Again, there are things in the game world that the PCs cannot achieve in any game. Certainly if a PC said "I want to breath fire like that dragon did to us" you wouldn't say "you're not special enough" (Yes, a dragonborn PC can do it, but I think you understand my point). Lack of such a baseline knowledge or expectation could be a concern. I don't know if I agree that it would lead to the actual mechanical abilities losing value. I mean, the DM is there to let them know if something is impossible or possible, and if possible if a check is required. That doesn't really change. I don't really follow this one. But if you mean that a player may complain that the ogre didn't have to make a STR check to knock down the tree, then I would say, as I have above in previous comments, that I would indeed establish some kind of house rule to address such concerns, i.e. Large creatures having advantage on STR checks or something similar. Again, I don't really think this is very concerning. Because ultimately, those bad guys doing such threatening things? They lost to the PCs. For me, it's about creating a dynamic encounter for the PCs to face and hopefully overcome rather than about faithfully simulating real world physics. Because that's an impossibility at some point, no matter what. The system breaks down eventually, no matter how strictly it's applied....so I just decide to only apply it where it is needed. Also, I am not saying that you cannot allow PCs to attempt cool actions. Let them if that's what makes them excited to play. Because I said one thing was beyond the PCs does not mean all things are. Whatever idea my PCs come up with, I at least consider. But I think the whole "say yes" is meant as a guideline, not as an absolute. There are certain things the PCs cannot do....so sometimes you have to say no. However, I'm more than willing to give all but the most outlandish and farfetched of ideas a chance. Sure, why not? A PC who has been Enlarged can do what the ogre can, too. I wouldn't have a problem with that. Why would I? What's to be gained by not letting that happen? Preservation of some semblance of real world physics? Meh. I think if I compare the two scenarios....where an ogre and a magically enlarged paladin are knocking trees over at each other, and another where we stop the game to see if it's even possible, and then with a failure the ogre or the PC has wasted their turn.....I prefer the first scenario. There are already many ways in which NPCs, in particular monster NPCs, are designed and function differently than PCs that I don't really see an issue with this. My goal is to keep things moving at the table, and for things to be exciting and dynamic. [/QUOTE]
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