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<blockquote data-quote="eamon" data-source="post: 3731596" data-attributes="member: 51942">The DMG guidelines suggest that the CR of a 20th level warrior is indeed 19.&nbsp; This is completely off bat however, the real CR is at least a few points lower.The DMG guidelines aren't very accurate beyond 5th level, at best.&nbsp; The difference between a 20th level warrior and a 19th level fighter are much much more than a CR (I wonder exactly what this OGL simulator does to not notice this).&nbsp; First of all, a warrior isn't using the elite array (or 25point buy) but simply the normal array (or 15 point buy), which makes quite a difference right off the bat.&nbsp; The extra HP are relevant, as is the hugely increased power of so many feats.&nbsp; An NPC warrior is thus at least 2 CR lower than an NPC fighter, and an NPC fighter of 19th level isn't accurately described as CR 19 either (just compare it to others in the MM, or imagine the challenge one such fighter would pose a 19th level PC party - namely pretty much none whatsoever).&nbsp; The differences between PC and NPC wealth are huge at high levels, but in any case, don't use the DMG guidelines blindly, unless you really don't care about accuracy at all.This thread contains some discussion about judging ECL's<a href="http://forums.gleemax.com/archive/index.php/t-885205.html" target="_blank">http://forums.gleemax.com/archive/index.php/t-885205.html</a>There's no particular conclusion, but for NPC's with PC abilities + classes the CR is judged to be about 1 lower than their level, and at mid-to-high level, 2 lower.&nbsp; NPC warriors not using the elite array should be about again a CR or two lower (again the difference is greater at higher levels).To be entirely clear, that's what I think the appropriate rating of such a challenge is.&nbsp; The DMG guidelines are different.&nbsp; But I'm positive that those aren't any good ;-).Another thing to keep in mind: an NPC has wealth according to his ECL if you follow RAW.&nbsp; however, this is obscene.&nbsp; Give him wealth according to his CR instead, and you'll be happier ;-).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="eamon, post: 3731596, member: 51942"] The DMG guidelines suggest that the CR of a 20th level warrior is indeed 19. This is completely off bat however, the real CR is at least a few points lower. The DMG guidelines aren't very accurate beyond 5th level, at best. The difference between a 20th level warrior and a 19th level fighter are much much more than a CR (I wonder exactly what this OGL simulator does to not notice this). First of all, a warrior isn't using the elite array (or 25point buy) but simply the normal array (or 15 point buy), which makes quite a difference right off the bat. The extra HP are relevant, as is the hugely increased power of so many feats. An NPC warrior is thus at least 2 CR lower than an NPC fighter, and an NPC fighter of 19th level isn't accurately described as CR 19 either (just compare it to others in the MM, or imagine the challenge one such fighter would pose a 19th level PC party - namely pretty much none whatsoever). The differences between PC and NPC wealth are huge at high levels, but in any case, don't use the DMG guidelines blindly, unless you really don't care about accuracy at all. This thread contains some discussion about judging ECL's [url]http://forums.gleemax.com/archive/index.php/t-885205.html[/url] There's no particular conclusion, but for NPC's with PC abilities + classes the CR is judged to be about 1 lower than their level, and at mid-to-high level, 2 lower. NPC warriors not using the elite array should be about again a CR or two lower (again the difference is greater at higher levels). To be entirely clear, that's what I think the appropriate rating of such a challenge is. The DMG guidelines are different. But I'm positive that those aren't any good ;-). Another thing to keep in mind: an NPC has wealth according to his ECL if you follow RAW. however, this is obscene. Give him wealth according to his CR instead, and you'll be happier ;-). [/QUOTE]

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