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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DracoSuave" data-source="post: 4586592" data-attributes="member: 71571">Well, if you create using the PC generator, you generate 5 PCs.These PCs are going to be using the same rules as -your- PCs and therefore should have equivalent stats and abilities.All things considered, that would make them equivalent to the party members in terms of attacking and defensive power.  That means that the battle becomes a coinflip, with any error in this accounted for by the PC's ability to create more streamlined characters over yours, or vice versa.The PCs would have a chance to down the NPCs, and the NPCs would have an equal chance to defeat the PCs.  You know this because if you switched the character sheets of the NPCs with the PCs, you'd have an equivalent scenario, with the players having the same level characters, against the same level antagonists.A coinflip battle is considered a -very- hard battle in 4e rules.  Anecdote is not the singular of data.  If you ran a series of battles like that, with NPCs created using the same rules as PCs, it will mostly tend towards defeat of the PCs about 50 percent of the time.Ask yourself this?  How many times has a PC outlayed as much damage -in a single round- as they have hps, or more?  If this happens often, then equivalent NPCs can have the same expectations.As an example:  Take the encounter I had above, a level 5 barbarian and a level 5 bravura warlord.  The character with initiative moved forward, and attacked the barbarian.  Thank god I was running him as an elite using NPC rules, because as a PC, he would have used his level 1 daily, action point for level 5 Rage Strike, dealing 14d6+stuff, followed by charging another party member for 3d6+stuff, and then 2d6+stuff (bravura), killing the paladin, then bringing another so close to death that three other characters similiarly statted would clean up.That combat would have been decided by the initiative rolls, and not by the tactics over the course of the battle.  Thank -goodness- I used the elite rules, which ended in one less encounter, one less daily per monster, which with two less monsters, ended with 6 less daily powers and 6 less encounter powers destroying the group.</blockquote>

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