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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celtavian" data-source="post: 6481940" data-attributes="member: 5834">No. I have to wait until a game designer either agrees or disagrees with my interpretation.The rule is clear. What isn't clear is the usual group of people that want to add exceptions to a rule without the exceptions existing. This happens on the Internet all the time. If it isn't clear, explain a scenario where you get to make Stealth check against a creature with Blindsight within its range? Are you going to allow general stealth checks? Are you going to allow invisibility to work? Are you going to argue that a moving individual isn't a part of the surroundings? Surroundings is a word that means everything around it. It's not ambiguous.This discussion is the usual thing you get on the Internet. A bunch of people wanting to add things that aren't in a rule because it isn't written out for them in the way they want. All the people that disagree have been stating is "I don't agree". Not what works within range of Blindsight or if a Stealth check is allowed. Or invisibility. Or how any of that works against Blindsight.So why don't some of these people claiming it doesn't detect everything within range, explain exactly what they allow in their games and why. I'll come at it from that angle. Explain why they think invisibility and stealth work.Why does Blindsight a separate entry and a range if it does not detect everything within range? Why not list it as Blindsight and give it no range allowing stealth and the like to work? Why does a dragon with very good senses to begin with need Blindsight if it doesn't detect everything within its range including invisible and stealthing creatures? Might as well leave it with only the usual senses if Blindsight  isn't superior. Seriously, why would you give a dragon Blindsight given all its other senses work just fine?Are the people claiming a dragon's blindsight doesn't detect everything allowing Stealth rolls against it based on what...hearing....smell...touch? What Does a dragon's blindsight go off. It already has hearing, touch, and smell.If Blindsight doesn't defeat Stealth and invisibility, what does it do for a creature like a dragon? Nothing since these folks disagreeing with me are basically saying it must make a regular Perception check that it would have had to make with its regular senses.Because there are a number of people disagreeing does not make them anymore correct than at any time in the past such as when the Flat World Theory was the norm. So that part of your argument is weak. I'd rather see you explain why the designers would bother to give blindsight to a creature with all of its regular senses and extraordinary Perception score. What would be the point?While the disagreeable contemplate the above questions around their tables when they come up, I'm going to wait until the Sage provides an answer to continue the debate as I believe that will be the only way to settle this one way or the other.</blockquote>

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