Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 8959078" data-attributes="member: 6696971">This is not correct.&nbsp; In the games that facilitate the sort of play that [USER=82106]@AbdulAlhazred[/USER] is talking about, the system has a huge amount of say (which is why I've historically called this phenomena &quot;system's say!&quot;).&nbsp; Neither GMs nor players get to short-shrift or curtail that &quot;system's say.&quot;&nbsp; It constrains moments of play specifically and it binds play broadly by giving it a superstructure.&nbsp; This is done via transparent, table-facing procedures, rules, principles, and an overarching agenda for play from which those things all stem from. Typically, what people who haven't played these games conceive of when they try to imagine this sort of play is not &quot;secret railroading.&quot;&nbsp; The typical (brutally mistaken) epithet is &quot;that sounds board-gamey.&quot;Both are deeply mistaken, but the latter is at least somewhat understandable because boardgames have a significant amount of &quot;system's say&quot; that participants can't just NOPE OUT of.&nbsp; The reason why participants don't opt out of the constraining rules/procedures, principles, superstructure of these games is simple; &quot;they work.&quot;&nbsp; They work to produce the sort of play that is advertised on the tin of these games (so why in the world would you opt out!).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 8959078, member: 6696971"] This is not correct. In the games that facilitate the sort of play that [USER=82106]@AbdulAlhazred[/USER] is talking about, the system has a huge amount of say (which is why I've historically called this phenomena "system's say!"). Neither GMs nor players get to short-shrift or curtail that "system's say." It constrains moments of play specifically and it binds play broadly by giving it a superstructure. This is done via transparent, table-facing procedures, rules, principles, and an overarching agenda for play from which those things all stem from. Typically, what people who haven't played these games conceive of when they try to imagine this sort of play is not "secret railroading." The typical (brutally mistaken) epithet is "that sounds board-gamey." Both are deeply mistaken, but the latter is at least somewhat understandable because boardgames have a significant amount of "system's say" that participants can't just NOPE OUT of. The reason why participants don't opt out of the constraining rules/procedures, principles, superstructure of these games is simple; "they work." They work to produce the sort of play that is advertised on the tin of these games (so why in the world would you opt out!). [/QUOTE]

Verification