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<blockquote data-quote="Arial Black" data-source="post: 7775621" data-attributes="member: 6799649"><p>We do agree on that.</p><p></p><p>Where we disagree is on the 'rule' you made up restricting when on my turn I can take my bonus action.</p><p></p><p>On p189 of the PHB, in the section entitled Bonus Actions, it tells you the rules for...bonus actions! There was a clue in the name!</p><p></p><p>It says, "<strong>You</strong> choose <strong>when</strong> to take a bonus during your turn, unless the bonus action's timing is specified".</p><p></p><p>It says nothing like, "...except during another action", or, "...except between taking the Attack action and executing your first attack".</p><p></p><p>The only 'timing' regarding Shield Master is that you only get it "If you take the Attack action on your turn". <em>Even if</em> you regard this as a straight statement of causality, that results in you being able to choose to take the bonus action shield bash at the same time as you take the Attack action that 'caused' it.</p><p></p><p>There is no rule forbidding simultaneous Actions In Combat, only rules which mean that each separate game <em>element</em> must be <em>resolved</em> sequentially.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The <em>presence</em> of a rule that says you CAN take it when you want during your turn, and the complete <em>absence</em> of a rule forbidding it, means you CAN do that!</p><p></p><p>There is absolutely no burden upon the Bonus Action rules to spell out every single occasion you CAN use it! All it needs is to say you CAN use it when you want, and that is enough. It is 'what it says on the tin'!</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That's what I just said! We DO have a rule which says you can, on p189 of the PHB!</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I am! I'm doing what is says on the tin, which is "You choose when to take a bonus action on your turn"! It's <em>you</em> who's inventing unwritten extra restrictions in crayon!</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And the rule which says you can move between attacks is true.</p><p></p><p>And the rule which says you can take your bonus action when you want in your turn is also true.</p><p></p><p>They are not mutually exclusive! The rule allowing you to move between attacks is <strong>not</strong> a rule <em>disallowing</em> anything else between attacks, and this unwritten 'rule' cannot trump the written rule which says that you choose when to take your bonus action.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>PHB, p189.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The presence of the rule on p189 means I can. That, combined with no rule forbidding it, means I can.</p><p></p><p>It is absurd to assume that the general rule regarding when you can take your bonus action must include every single specific exception! That's not how the rules work and you know it!</p><p></p><p>IF there were a written rule (not in crayon!) that says that 'during' the Attack action is an exception to the general rule on the timing of bonus actions, then you'd be right. There is not, so you're wrong. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Not so. There IS a rule which says you CAN on p189, and no rule which forbids it. The permission to <em>move</em> between attacks does not trump other rules which say you CAN do those things whenever they say they can be used.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>PHB p189 disagrees.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I do have permission. It's on p189.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>There is nothing illogical about doing things between attacks!</p><p></p><p>The fact that you may lose the opportunity to <em>execute</em> those attacks is already an element of the game (<em>sanctuary</em>, Readied actions, <em>contingency</em>) and does not present a problem whatsoever. You took both the action and the bonus action at the same time, and chose the order of resolution.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It's on p189. It says I can choose when to take my bonus action during my turn.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I've quoted the rule; it's on p189.</p><p></p><p>Meanwhile, you've added crayon rules to add restrictions. Fine at your table, but we are discussing RAW. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>True.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Arial Black, post: 7775621, member: 6799649"] We do agree on that. Where we disagree is on the 'rule' you made up restricting when on my turn I can take my bonus action. On p189 of the PHB, in the section entitled Bonus Actions, it tells you the rules for...bonus actions! There was a clue in the name! It says, "[b]You[/b] choose [b]when[/b] to take a bonus during your turn, unless the bonus action's timing is specified". It says nothing like, "...except during another action", or, "...except between taking the Attack action and executing your first attack". The only 'timing' regarding Shield Master is that you only get it "If you take the Attack action on your turn". [i]Even if[/i] you regard this as a straight statement of causality, that results in you being able to choose to take the bonus action shield bash at the same time as you take the Attack action that 'caused' it. There is no rule forbidding simultaneous Actions In Combat, only rules which mean that each separate game [i]element[/i] must be [i]resolved[/i] sequentially. The [i]presence[/i] of a rule that says you CAN take it when you want during your turn, and the complete [i]absence[/i] of a rule forbidding it, means you CAN do that! There is absolutely no burden upon the Bonus Action rules to spell out every single occasion you CAN use it! All it needs is to say you CAN use it when you want, and that is enough. It is 'what it says on the tin'! That's what I just said! We DO have a rule which says you can, on p189 of the PHB! I am! I'm doing what is says on the tin, which is "You choose when to take a bonus action on your turn"! It's [i]you[/i] who's inventing unwritten extra restrictions in crayon! And the rule which says you can move between attacks is true. And the rule which says you can take your bonus action when you want in your turn is also true. They are not mutually exclusive! The rule allowing you to move between attacks is [b]not[/b] a rule [i]disallowing[/i] anything else between attacks, and this unwritten 'rule' cannot trump the written rule which says that you choose when to take your bonus action. PHB, p189. The presence of the rule on p189 means I can. That, combined with no rule forbidding it, means I can. It is absurd to assume that the general rule regarding when you can take your bonus action must include every single specific exception! That's not how the rules work and you know it! IF there were a written rule (not in crayon!) that says that 'during' the Attack action is an exception to the general rule on the timing of bonus actions, then you'd be right. There is not, so you're wrong. Not so. There IS a rule which says you CAN on p189, and no rule which forbids it. The permission to [i]move[/i] between attacks does not trump other rules which say you CAN do those things whenever they say they can be used. PHB p189 disagrees. I do have permission. It's on p189. There is nothing illogical about doing things between attacks! The fact that you may lose the opportunity to [i]execute[/i] those attacks is already an element of the game ([i]sanctuary[/i], Readied actions, [i]contingency[/i]) and does not present a problem whatsoever. You took both the action and the bonus action at the same time, and chose the order of resolution. It's on p189. It says I can choose when to take my bonus action during my turn. I've quoted the rule; it's on p189. Meanwhile, you've added crayon rules to add restrictions. Fine at your table, but we are discussing RAW. True. [/QUOTE]
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