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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
official revision to skill challenge system
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<blockquote data-quote="Paul Strack" data-source="post: 4392246" data-attributes="member: 71340"><p><strong>Tactical Options for skill challenges.</strong></p><p></p><p>Here is a dump of some of the tactical options I am considering for skill challenges (draft only). To balance them, I give them complexity adjustments. This is what I meant when I said "making challenge options more rigorously defined as part of the rules".</p><p></p><p><strong>Extra Primary Skills (-1 complexity per Skill):</strong> A challenge can have more Primary Skills than normal. Each additional primary skill above three reduces the challenge complexity by -1.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Two Skills (+1 complexity):</strong> A challenge with only two Primary Skills counts as +1 complexity.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Single Skill (+3 complexity):</strong> A challenge with only one Primary Skill can be very difficult and counts as +3 complexity. A single-skill challenge option should be balanced with something else to reduce the difficulty. Opt-Out or Aid Another are good balancing options.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Limited-Use Skills (-1 complexity):</strong> The challenge includes two additional Primary Skill, but those skills can only be used successfully only a limited number of times in the challenge. Once the skills have added successes equal to the basic complexity of the challenge, they cannot be used any more in the challenge. If appropriate, the successes for the limit-used use skill may be required instead of optional. This option should generally be balanced against primary skills than normal. This option is good for defining a "sub-challenge" as part of the main challenge.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Secret Skills (+1 complexity):</strong> Sometimes the list of Primary Skills for a challenge isn't obvious. The party should always have a general idea of which skills to use (social skills in a social challenge) but they may not know, for example, that the Duke reacts poorly to Intimidation attempts. Using the wrong skill either counts as an automatic failure or increases the DC of the skill check to the Hard skill rating. This option works well in combination with the Information Skills and the Easy Skill option.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Information Skills (-l or -2 complexity):</strong> Information skills are two extra skills that can be used with the challenge, generally knowledge skills, Perception or Insight. Each success provides information about the challenge. This could reveal which skills are best for the challenge, give knowledge of special bonuses that can be earned or unlock an Easy Skill. There is only so much information that can be gleaned, so information skills can only be used successfully a limited number of times. The number of pieces of information available should equal the base complexity of the challenge.</p><p> </p><p>Successes and failures on the information skill normally still count toward victory or defeat in the challenge. If they do not, this challenge option has a complexity adjustment of -2 instead of -1.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Easy Skill (+0 or -l complexity):</strong> This options adds another skill that can be used more easily than others in the challenge, using the Easy DC instead of the Moderate DC. An easy skill should only be used with secret-skill challenge. Generally, the characters must guess correctly or succeed at an information skill check before they "unlock" the easy skill. If the easy skill can only be used once, this doesn't modify the complexity of the challenge. If the easy skill can be used multiple times, up to the base complexity of the challenge, this option reduced the complexity by -1.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Creative Skills (+0 complexity):</strong> Characters can attempt to use any skill with the challenge rather than the listed primary skills, but only if the player can justify using that skill. Each creative skill can only be used once in the challenge, and only if the GM agrees that it is appropriate. Once a player uses Arcana creatively in a challenge, no other player can use that skill, whether the check succeeds or fails. Furthermore, the DC for the check is the Hard DC number, not the easy number. This option just not adjust the challenge complexity, but it entirely up to the DM whether it is allowed.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Costly Failures (+1 complexity):</strong> Characters lose some limited resource for each failed skill roll in the challenge. This could be gold, healing surges or magical Residuum. Healing surges can be lost to represent exertion or injury in physical challenges. If equipment or gold is lost, it should equal 10% of the value of a magic item of challenge's level for each failure. The resource lost must matter to the characters. Healing surges only count as a costly failure if the party cannot take an extended rest before their next combat encounter. In a challenge with costly failures, the consequences of defeat may simply be the lose of additional resources.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Extra Exertion (+0 complexity):</strong> The character can expend a resource, either to re-roll failures or buy successes for the challenge. This could be spending an Action Point, a healing surge or a daily power appropriate to the kind of challenges. The resource spent resource should allow a re-roll for a failed check (for action points or healing surges) or to buy a success without making a skill roll. Because the character is expending resources to improve their odds of victory, this doesn't modify the complexity of the challenge. Like costly failures, only resources that matter can be spent.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Helping Hand (+0 complexity):</strong> The character voluntarily takes a -2 penalty of her skill check to give another character a +2 bonus on his next skill check. Since the bonus and penalty even out, this does not modify the complexity of the challenge. Only one character can give a helping hand to another character at a time. This option is especially appropriate to challenges with costly failures.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Aid Another (-2 or -1 complexity):</strong> A character can choose to Aid Another by making an Easy Skill check with the skill being aided. Unlike other checks, success or failure on this check does not count towards victory or defeat in the challenge. Instead, a success gives the aided character a +2 bonus and a failure has no effect. Each a party member can only be the recipient of a single Aid Another check each round in the challenge. That party member must make a skill check with that skill on his next turn, whether or not the Aid Another attempt succeed.</p><p> </p><p>Normally Aid Another can be used by any party member to help any other party member and reduced the challenge complexity by -2. If Aid Another can only be used to help a designated party leader once per round, this option only reduces the complexity by -1.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Opt Out (-3 complexity):</strong> If party members can choose not to participate in the challenge, it becomes much easier, because only those party members with the best skills need to roll. This option should be balanced with other options that make the challenge more difficult, such as a single-skill challenge or making the challenge higher level than the party.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Total Victory (+0 complexity):</strong> Normally a challenge ends when a party accumulates successes equal to the victory threshold. This option lets the party continue to roll past this threshold to gain some additional benefit. If the party manages to get two more successes above the Victory Threshold, before they reach the defeat threshold, they achieve a total victory and the added benefit. If they reach the defeat threshold before the achieve total victory, they only achieve a normal victory instead.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Partial Victory (+1 complexity):</strong> This option is similar to total victory above, except that the party suffer some setback if they only achieve a partial victory (an extra complication or some lost resource). The party can push on to achieve a total victory by earning two successes beyond the Victory Threshold if they want to win a clean victory with no side effects. The only difference between this option and the total victory option is that the party is penalized for only earning a partial victory instead of getting a bonus for earning a total victory.</p><p> </p><p><strong>Fewer Failures (+1 complexity):</strong> This option reduces the number of failures the party can have in a challenge. Each -1 to the failure threshold adds 1 to the complexity. This option should only be used to balance some of the beneficial options that reduce complexities, such as Opt-Out or Aid Another.</p><p></p><p> <strong>Short Challenge:</strong> Short challenges take less time than normal. Halve the number of successes and failures needed to complete the challenge. Halve adjustments for options like Total Victory, Partial Victory and Fewer Failures as well. This does not adjust the complexity, but the XP earned from winning the challenge is also halved. Challenges with multiple parts can be broken up into a series of short challenges. An opt-out, single-skill short challenge is a good choice for challenges in combat.</p><p></p><p><em>EDIT: In case it isn't clear, I don't think every one one of these options should be applied to every challenge. When the DM designs a challenge, he skills the basic challenge and its complexity and layers on a fewer options to make it interesting and different from other challenges.</em></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>This makes challenges more like the core rules, where you have a simple base system to which you can add additional special rules on a case-by-case basis.</em></p><p><em></em></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Paul Strack, post: 4392246, member: 71340"] [b]Tactical Options for skill challenges.[/b] Here is a dump of some of the tactical options I am considering for skill challenges (draft only). To balance them, I give them complexity adjustments. This is what I meant when I said "making challenge options more rigorously defined as part of the rules". [B]Extra Primary Skills (-1 complexity per Skill):[/B] A challenge can have more Primary Skills than normal. Each additional primary skill above three reduces the challenge complexity by -1. [B]Two Skills (+1 complexity):[/B] A challenge with only two Primary Skills counts as +1 complexity. [B]Single Skill (+3 complexity):[/B] A challenge with only one Primary Skill can be very difficult and counts as +3 complexity. A single-skill challenge option should be balanced with something else to reduce the difficulty. Opt-Out or Aid Another are good balancing options. [B]Limited-Use Skills (-1 complexity):[/B] The challenge includes two additional Primary Skill, but those skills can only be used successfully only a limited number of times in the challenge. Once the skills have added successes equal to the basic complexity of the challenge, they cannot be used any more in the challenge. If appropriate, the successes for the limit-used use skill may be required instead of optional. This option should generally be balanced against primary skills than normal. This option is good for defining a "sub-challenge" as part of the main challenge. [B]Secret Skills (+1 complexity):[/B] Sometimes the list of Primary Skills for a challenge isn't obvious. The party should always have a general idea of which skills to use (social skills in a social challenge) but they may not know, for example, that the Duke reacts poorly to Intimidation attempts. Using the wrong skill either counts as an automatic failure or increases the DC of the skill check to the Hard skill rating. This option works well in combination with the Information Skills and the Easy Skill option. [B]Information Skills (-l or -2 complexity):[/B] Information skills are two extra skills that can be used with the challenge, generally knowledge skills, Perception or Insight. Each success provides information about the challenge. This could reveal which skills are best for the challenge, give knowledge of special bonuses that can be earned or unlock an Easy Skill. There is only so much information that can be gleaned, so information skills can only be used successfully a limited number of times. The number of pieces of information available should equal the base complexity of the challenge. Successes and failures on the information skill normally still count toward victory or defeat in the challenge. If they do not, this challenge option has a complexity adjustment of -2 instead of -1. [B]Easy Skill (+0 or -l complexity):[/B] This options adds another skill that can be used more easily than others in the challenge, using the Easy DC instead of the Moderate DC. An easy skill should only be used with secret-skill challenge. Generally, the characters must guess correctly or succeed at an information skill check before they "unlock" the easy skill. If the easy skill can only be used once, this doesn't modify the complexity of the challenge. If the easy skill can be used multiple times, up to the base complexity of the challenge, this option reduced the complexity by -1. [B]Creative Skills (+0 complexity):[/B] Characters can attempt to use any skill with the challenge rather than the listed primary skills, but only if the player can justify using that skill. Each creative skill can only be used once in the challenge, and only if the GM agrees that it is appropriate. Once a player uses Arcana creatively in a challenge, no other player can use that skill, whether the check succeeds or fails. Furthermore, the DC for the check is the Hard DC number, not the easy number. This option just not adjust the challenge complexity, but it entirely up to the DM whether it is allowed. [B]Costly Failures (+1 complexity):[/B] Characters lose some limited resource for each failed skill roll in the challenge. This could be gold, healing surges or magical Residuum. Healing surges can be lost to represent exertion or injury in physical challenges. If equipment or gold is lost, it should equal 10% of the value of a magic item of challenge's level for each failure. The resource lost must matter to the characters. Healing surges only count as a costly failure if the party cannot take an extended rest before their next combat encounter. In a challenge with costly failures, the consequences of defeat may simply be the lose of additional resources. [B]Extra Exertion (+0 complexity):[/B] The character can expend a resource, either to re-roll failures or buy successes for the challenge. This could be spending an Action Point, a healing surge or a daily power appropriate to the kind of challenges. The resource spent resource should allow a re-roll for a failed check (for action points or healing surges) or to buy a success without making a skill roll. Because the character is expending resources to improve their odds of victory, this doesn't modify the complexity of the challenge. Like costly failures, only resources that matter can be spent. [B]Helping Hand (+0 complexity):[/B] The character voluntarily takes a -2 penalty of her skill check to give another character a +2 bonus on his next skill check. Since the bonus and penalty even out, this does not modify the complexity of the challenge. Only one character can give a helping hand to another character at a time. This option is especially appropriate to challenges with costly failures. [B]Aid Another (-2 or -1 complexity):[/B] A character can choose to Aid Another by making an Easy Skill check with the skill being aided. Unlike other checks, success or failure on this check does not count towards victory or defeat in the challenge. Instead, a success gives the aided character a +2 bonus and a failure has no effect. Each a party member can only be the recipient of a single Aid Another check each round in the challenge. That party member must make a skill check with that skill on his next turn, whether or not the Aid Another attempt succeed. Normally Aid Another can be used by any party member to help any other party member and reduced the challenge complexity by -2. If Aid Another can only be used to help a designated party leader once per round, this option only reduces the complexity by -1. [B]Opt Out (-3 complexity):[/B] If party members can choose not to participate in the challenge, it becomes much easier, because only those party members with the best skills need to roll. This option should be balanced with other options that make the challenge more difficult, such as a single-skill challenge or making the challenge higher level than the party. [B]Total Victory (+0 complexity):[/B] Normally a challenge ends when a party accumulates successes equal to the victory threshold. This option lets the party continue to roll past this threshold to gain some additional benefit. If the party manages to get two more successes above the Victory Threshold, before they reach the defeat threshold, they achieve a total victory and the added benefit. If they reach the defeat threshold before the achieve total victory, they only achieve a normal victory instead. [B]Partial Victory (+1 complexity):[/B] This option is similar to total victory above, except that the party suffer some setback if they only achieve a partial victory (an extra complication or some lost resource). The party can push on to achieve a total victory by earning two successes beyond the Victory Threshold if they want to win a clean victory with no side effects. The only difference between this option and the total victory option is that the party is penalized for only earning a partial victory instead of getting a bonus for earning a total victory. [B]Fewer Failures (+1 complexity):[/B] This option reduces the number of failures the party can have in a challenge. Each -1 to the failure threshold adds 1 to the complexity. This option should only be used to balance some of the beneficial options that reduce complexities, such as Opt-Out or Aid Another. [B]Short Challenge:[/B] Short challenges take less time than normal. Halve the number of successes and failures needed to complete the challenge. Halve adjustments for options like Total Victory, Partial Victory and Fewer Failures as well. This does not adjust the complexity, but the XP earned from winning the challenge is also halved. Challenges with multiple parts can be broken up into a series of short challenges. An opt-out, single-skill short challenge is a good choice for challenges in combat. [I]EDIT: In case it isn't clear, I don't think every one one of these options should be applied to every challenge. When the DM designs a challenge, he skills the basic challenge and its complexity and layers on a fewer options to make it interesting and different from other challenges. This makes challenges more like the core rules, where you have a simple base system to which you can add additional special rules on a case-by-case basis. [/I] [/QUOTE]
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