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Message: <blockquote data-quote="smathis" data-source="post: 4257093" data-attributes="member: 56465">This. In a big way.In 3e, I was constantly getting screwed because I had a "well-rounded" character with actual skill-points in a "profession" of all things to represent my background. This meant that by 6th level or so I could do all sorts of meaningless, tangential things to the actual adventure -- while the Rogue surpassed me in Arcana or some other schtick-crapping thing.It came to the point, rather quickly in my 3e days, where I would play nothing but a maxed out Dwarven Cleric. Sure, it was boring. But it kept me from getting thrown to the lions.To me, 3e seemed to be about character builds and being skilled or lucky enough to survive long enough to optimize that character. After that point, it was mostly a matter of wrecking the system, party or whatever. Granted, not everyone played it that way. But that was my experience with it in three separate groups.For example, I'd show up with a Human Sorcerer suffering under a long-standing family curse that had forced him to survive as a beggar. The guy next to me would have a Tiefling/Drow Rogue with some sort of darkness and firebally power, the guy next to him would have a half-dragon/kobold with some sort of flying power, a breath weapon and DR, next to him a Celestial/Elf or some such that could walk on water at will, ad infinitum.The end result?I got dead because I was the least sub-optimal build while these other players basically devolved into a gambit of "see how much damage I can do" or "dude, I just rolled a 38 on my skill check".Teamwork rarely, if ever, entered the equation.And this is not one group, mind you. It was three, all with different members and one over a thousand miles away from the other two.What I like about 4th edition is the emphasis on teamwork. I no longer have to worry about "builds" and keeping up with the min-maxers. I can play the character I want to play and not concern myself with whether or not I'll contribute (or be able to keep up) in combat.The system itself insures that I'll be capable of doing all this.As far as options? They're still there. Don't want to play a Rogue with Theivery? Fine. Don't take it as a trained skill. No one's going to send you to Gitmo for that.And Wizards have all the potential to be just as creative in play, with their cantrips, rituals and such. Utility powers are where it's at.It's hard for me not to see a bit of the old groups when I hear complaints like this. Sure, 4e is different. But if you're really unhappy that those 8 or so years of "rules mastery" are now sunk. And if you really don't like that the new edition makes the old builds, loopholes and rules arcana obsolete? Then play 3e.It's still there. There's no magic involved with the GSL that makes the old books go away as soon as you buy the new books. (At least for consumers. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> )But 4e is a new edition. There's a whole new set of rules to learn and master (in their own way). Give it a couple of weeks and someone will be on the boards with some hack or creative interpretation that gives the Fighter, Warlord or one of 'em some awesomely twisted game-breaking ability. Like the Paladin's Mark of Death.But I'm far from disappointed.</blockquote>

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