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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Snarf Zagyg" data-source="post: 9119834" data-attributes="member: 7023840">So, beyond the torturing point, I think it's absolutely necessary when discussing 1e rules to disambiguate two important things-1. What people did. Or, at least, claimed they did. Seriously- I've written an entire post about memory for a reason, and while I think we are all good and honorable gamers who are never given to hyperbole* or memory lapses or confusing how we played 1e and 2e ... but sometimes people are wrong about their own experiences. And ... even if they aren't .... even if they are 150% accurate, they aren't speaking for how everyone played. As we all know, get five grognards together to discuss how "people played 1e back in the day," and you'll get six different versions. Because TSR-era D&D, especially 70s and 80s D&D, was notoriously uneven from table to table. Not just because of house rules, and 3PP, and because lots of table simply ignored rules ... but also lots of people weren't even aware of a lot of the rules that existed.So, if even Gygax himself (blessed be his rolls) didn't play AD&D according to the rules he wrote, I don't think it's particularly helpful in discussing the rules qua rules to say, "Yeah, well, I just didn't know about that rule or do it that way," when talking about what the actual rule was. That said, if you want to talk about your personal experience, that's cool! But that's not really discussing or diving into the rule, which is what is interesting right now. 2. What the rules actually said. For better or worse (most would say ... for worse), AD&D instilled within my a lifelong love of how overly complicated and unclear rules interact with each other. So I find the subject of the rules interactions within 1e, regardless of how often they were applied in real life or how often they were used correctly, absolutely fascinating. Because it really gets into issues that have salience far beyond D&D. How do you understand language (like, say, "primary attribute(s)"). How do different rules interact? When rules conflict, how can you harmonize them (or, in the alternative, which rules take precedence)? And for this purpose, what counts as an "official authority." How official is "official?" Sage Advice has actually been with us now, in various version and in various media, since November 1979, and has had various levels of authority; arguably, it was "most official" from Dragon 42 on in that incarnation, and demoted to "here's what we were thinking, but it's not, you know, official official" in the most recent incarnation.....but maybe that's for a separate thread. *Look, you whippersnapper with your attack cantrips and your healing hit dice and your feats. Back in the day, I used to walk 10 miles in a snowstorm, uphill, just so that I could play a first level Magic User with 2 hit points. And you know what? I'd get there, and cast my single light spell that the monster saved, and right after that I was killed, KILLED by a kobold with a dull butter knife. And you know what I did then? I'd walk 10 miles back, ALSO UPHILL, in that same snowstorm. That's how I PLAYED REAL D&D, AND I LOVED IT!</blockquote>

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