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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Master Witch" data-source="post: 4339982" data-attributes="member: 71055">            Ok let’s look at the numbers here. You need to start by picking an encounter level. The DM says that an encounter should be N – 2 to N + 4 levels above or below the level of a 5 person party (adjust for number of players). Now let’s look at an example, 5 first level characters that fill all 4 roles in the game (this seems to be a big deal in 4E). So for that first level party they should never face higher then a level 5 minion. This would let you have 2 minions for every first level character. 5 players can face 500 XP worth of monsters so the level 5 “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper” fits the bill with their AC of 20. However 10 level 5 “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper” would take a little luck to win against compared to say the level 1 “Giant Rat” with an AC of 15. My level 1 Ranger with a +8 to hit with my “Careful Attack” with a long bow would need to roll 12 or higher to hit a “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper”. This does not seem all that bad until you look at what the level 5 “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper” rolls to hit my AC of 16, they have a +11 to hit making their roll a whopping 5. The Giant Rats” + 6 to hit have to roll a 10 or better to hit me.             For the sack of simplicity let’s make this just my ranger VS 2 “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper”. I could get lucky in 2 rounds with 2 rolls of 12 or even one round if I used my “Twin Strike” with 2 roles of 14 or better to kill both minions. However for a monster that is meant to be a foot soldier their a lot harder to hit then the level 1 “Giant Rat” with an AC of 15. My “Careful Attack” with a long bow would need to roll 7 or higher to hit. Even my “Twin Strike” would only need a 9 to hit.             Now we need to look at damage. I have a total of 29 hit points (blooded at 14). The “Giant Rats” would take 10 hits to have me at 0 hit points with their 3 points of damage each hit. The “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper” does 5 necrotic damage (7 VS blooded targets). So I would be blooded in 3 hits and dead in 5, half the hits of the level 1 “Giant Rats”.            I admit at level 1 I as a single play could face 4 “Giant Rats” VS the 2 “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper” so in the end the “Giant Rats” with numbers on their side are about the same as the “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper” however the “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper” have a much greater chance of winning the fight if luck is on their side compared to the “Giant Rats”.             If you look at monsters in 4E they live on a sliding scale. By time my ranger is to level 5 I will have at least 3 more points for hitting, 2 for half my levels and at least 1 for a magic item. All of a sudden that “Vampire Spawn Fleshripper” is only 1 pointer harder to hit then the “Giant Rat” was at level 1.            In the end it all goes back to the encounter level and number of experience points you are going to have to spend to make up an encounter. The role of minions is to be cannon fodder as someone else posted but even from a role playing stand point there the guy that is happy just getting buy. He drinks every weekend, only trains when the higher ups say to and has no desire to change it. The monsters that know how to stay alive get of their backside and learn to fight. I don’t care if it’s a level 30 minion you make up yourself it is still a lazy no talent meat shield. Ok that was a lot longer then I meant it to be but I hope it adds to the topic and is not a bother to read.</blockquote>

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