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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 8968399" data-attributes="member: 4937">[USER=7027139]@loverdrive[/USER] : I'm struggling to understand why that response was even relevant.  Quite obviously a game isn't real.  That's a big part of what makes it a game.  You don't really make an interesting observation to say that it isn't real.Your point seems to undermine itself when you write: "It's a tool that feeds into fiction..."Right.  So, your mechanics go a long way to determining the sort of fictions that you produce.  The more disassociated your mechanics become, the harder of a time you will have to make the fiction that you produce seem like it isn't the story of a game or game universe.  So yes, you are correct turn-based abstractions produce fictions that tend to have problems where you can see that in the fiction people tend to wait for other people to react.  You can even see this for example in published authors.  For example, Jim Butcher writes action scenes (especially in his early works) that read as if they were generated by a turn-based combat system.  They read like fictions produced from something like a ttRPG.  Yes, obviously a fantasy universe isn't real, and yes obviously a fantasy universe where explicitly people can only make chess moves is self-consistent, but generally speaking a fantasy universe where the participants can only make chess moves isn't the fiction or fictional universe people were intending to generate.So there becomes a point where you have participants in the game who are saying, "I can't do the work to translate the fiction that we are producing into the fiction that I want, because the system is producing a fiction that has too many attributes of being produced by a game."  For some people, that might even be turn-based.  Most turn-based games have some rules in them to try to make them simulate non-linearity and if people abuse the rules to produce something like the elf fire brigade cannon to produce fiction that is obviously based on mechanics of a game and not implied universe, well then people will have problems with the rules and try to rectify it in some way.   There is reason that many systems make mention of things like segments or impulses to try to make turn-based systems better resemble the reality of continuous action.  Because people don't actually want to generate fiction that is obviously turn based when generated and put down to paper (as it were).Yes, obviously people understand there can't be a perfect 1 to 1 mapping between the generated fiction and the desired fiction, but that doesn't mean that all mappings are equally effective and elegant.</blockquote>

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