Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 8969383" data-attributes="member: 4937">I get that that is your intention, but that's very much a choice.&nbsp; For most RPGs in most of the history of RPGs, that idea that the combat minigame produces exactly zero fiction simply isn't true.&nbsp; For most RPGs in most of the history of RPGs, the combat minigame is producing fiction and is intended to both represent the fictional state and to produce fiction.&nbsp;&nbsp; Indeed, much of the evolution of RPGs in the first 15 years or so of their existence was to tighten the connection between the game mechanics and the fictional state so that combat minigame (or anything else) more closely produced the transcript of play and further produced a more cinematic transcript of play.&nbsp; (I use the term &quot;cinematic&quot; here to refer to the idea that everyone at the table is likely to closely imagine the same events from the transcript of play, that is, the process of play is producing a less abstract and more easily visualized result.)&nbsp; While there are limits to that and designers eventually realized that there were tradeoffs involved to that, the ideas involved in that period were never wholly relinquished in most game systems.Can you do something different?&nbsp; Sure.&nbsp; Is it going to be satisfying to everyone that the combat minigame is not recording the state of the fiction?&nbsp; Probably not.&nbsp;&nbsp; Aside from that, the sort of combat minigames you are talking about in the original post with moves constrained to chess like moves for the purpose of increasing the need to plan ahead or with moves limited to a random selection of cards aren't in fact the sort of pure minigames as fortune resolution mechanic akin to your &quot;Quake 3 duel&quot; whenever you roll the dice.&nbsp; That is to say, they are probably going to at least be recording, &quot;You are fighting six goblins in an abandoned temple with a roughly cross-shaped floor plan and an altar in the western section&quot; or &quot;You are fighting a blue dragon on a boulder field of broken scree during a thunderstorm&quot;.&nbsp; They aren't as abstracted from the fiction as you seem to claim.And aside from that, it ought to be obvious the utility of &quot;Quake 3 duel&quot; whenever you would need to test a fortune is probably lower than just rolling the dice if in fact &quot;Quake 3 duel&quot; isn't producing any transcript and is just a fortune mechanism.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 8969383, member: 4937"] I get that that is your intention, but that's very much a choice. For most RPGs in most of the history of RPGs, that idea that the combat minigame produces exactly zero fiction simply isn't true. For most RPGs in most of the history of RPGs, the combat minigame is producing fiction and is intended to both represent the fictional state and to produce fiction. Indeed, much of the evolution of RPGs in the first 15 years or so of their existence was to tighten the connection between the game mechanics and the fictional state so that combat minigame (or anything else) more closely produced the transcript of play and further produced a more cinematic transcript of play. (I use the term "cinematic" here to refer to the idea that everyone at the table is likely to closely imagine the same events from the transcript of play, that is, the process of play is producing a less abstract and more easily visualized result.) While there are limits to that and designers eventually realized that there were tradeoffs involved to that, the ideas involved in that period were never wholly relinquished in most game systems. Can you do something different? Sure. Is it going to be satisfying to everyone that the combat minigame is not recording the state of the fiction? Probably not. Aside from that, the sort of combat minigames you are talking about in the original post with moves constrained to chess like moves for the purpose of increasing the need to plan ahead or with moves limited to a random selection of cards aren't in fact the sort of pure minigames as fortune resolution mechanic akin to your "Quake 3 duel" whenever you roll the dice. That is to say, they are probably going to at least be recording, "You are fighting six goblins in an abandoned temple with a roughly cross-shaped floor plan and an altar in the western section" or "You are fighting a blue dragon on a boulder field of broken scree during a thunderstorm". They aren't as abstracted from the fiction as you seem to claim. And aside from that, it ought to be obvious the utility of "Quake 3 duel" whenever you would need to test a fortune is probably lower than just rolling the dice if in fact "Quake 3 duel" isn't producing any transcript and is just a fortune mechanism. [/QUOTE]

Verification