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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Lanefan" data-source="post: 6696440" data-attributes="member: 29398">It's objective fact, but you're coming at it from the wrong angle.  To explain... These are all fine reasons to play.  But I did not say "the reason to play is to gain levels", I said "the (or a primary) objective of the game is to gain levels".  Big difference.You play Scrabble to have fun and exercise your brain, etc.  The objective of the game is to score the most points.D&D of course isn't as cut-and-dried as Scrabble but at the most basic level the same kind of thing applies.  You play D&D to <see your reasons above>.  The (or an) objective of the game is to gain levels.And that basic objective is best fulfilled in all editions by killing foes, except in 1e where it is also fulfilled by gaining treasure (and, notably enough, can be fulfilled by avoiding foes instead of killing them).Now obviously that particular underlying objective isn't the primary *reason* for play in many circles, including mine, particularly in 1e games that have dropped xp-for-gp (and all 2e games) where level advancement is or can be very very slow.  But it's still there notwithstanding; and in 3e and 4e (and 5e, it seems) it's much more pronounced because you tend to level up just about every time you sneeze and levels do become the game instead of just a side effect of play.And it should be noted that I prefer level-ups to be no more than a side effect of ongoing play, and have stated such countless times in this forum.So, back to evil.  What's the point of defining a core objective of the game as inherently evil?  I'd posit there really isn't one.You've got it backward.  It's ridiculous to apply it to life, as you say, but not necessarily so ridiculous at all to apply it to the game.BADD tried that crap in the 80's, didn't they?  You have fun shouting.  Me, I'll be out recruiting players. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Greed is good in Monopoly; in fact, it's the entire point of the game.  Is Monopoly evil?Ah.  To me a munchkin (character) is one that has been build-optimized and mechanically designed to exploit loopholes and advantages in the rules without regard to its personality or characterization; and a munchkin (player) is one who does this sort of thing.Lan-"and to my way of thinking munchkins are every bit as evil as anything else you'll ever see in the game"-efan</blockquote>

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