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Message: <blockquote data-quote="sfedi" data-source="post: 5015542" data-attributes="member: 15746">What Starfox and Ryujin said, basically.The game values (save ends) effects as higher than (until start/end of XXX turn).And that simply is not true in several scenarios: - when the (save ends) is taken during your turn (pointed above) - when on a Daily hit you make the first save, and you end up with suffering the conidition less than if the attacker have failed the Daily (pointed above) - against Solos, they have a highly variable performance - since they are not stackable, it is quite more complicated to estimate the effectiveness of them, specially damage from an ongoing damage effectYou are right though, this not a HUGE ISSUE, they are more quirks, or annoying things that don't really break the game, but they cause a lot of problems for monster design and balancing powers.</blockquote>