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Message: <blockquote data-quote="overgeeked" data-source="post: 8672113" data-attributes="member: 86653">The issue I have with rules for things like that is it removes/reduces player agency and it still leads to weirdly unrealistic results.We have an infinitely better understanding of physics than we do of psychology. And even the rules in games that are meant to simulate physics are wonky and produce often laughably inaccurate results. Unless the designer of the game is a world-renowned psychologist, any rules for how characters must/should/would/could behave will more than likely be wildly, laughably terrible. The games that I've seen try things like this only reinforce that belief.The best worst example I know of is Monsterhearts and the Turn Somone On move."When you turn someone on, roll with hot. On a 10 up, take a String against them. • On a 7-9, they choose one: give themselves to you*, promise something they think you want, give you a String against them."Now, PbtA games are meant to be fiction first. Meaning in order to even make a roll for a move, your character must do the thing in the fiction first, and once that's done, then you get to roll for it. So it should be: do something you hope turns on the character, ask the player if that would turn on the character, if yes then roll, if no then no roll. Yet, in a weird paradox, this move violates that rather explicitly. This is even explained in the move itself."We don’t get to decide what turns us on. When you make a move to turn someone on (with a character action or with scene description), the other player doesn’t get to exclaim, “Wait, my character is straight! There’s no way that’d turn them on.” That’s a decision that we as players can’t make for our characters. The dice are going to be the ultimate referees of what is and isn’t sexy for these characters."So the player that wants to make this move simply gets to decide for you what turns your character on. They can literally describe anything and reasonably ask for a roll as a result.*But hey, at least the player still get to choose consent. That's nice.</blockquote>

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