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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 6468875" data-attributes="member: 22779">The problem is Saelorn, that has never existed in D&D.  And thus, the conflict resides with one side wanting to rewrite history and pretend that HP has always mean "physical integrity" while ignoring the fact that this is actually counter to the definition of HP presented in every single edition of D&D.   No, it is not consistent with every definition of Hit Points.  1e doesn't define HP this way, Basic/Expert definitely doesn't.  On and on.  HP have never been defined this way and it's historical revisionism to pretend otherwise.  Which is what is so confusing.  If, as you say, the game is worthless unless HP=Meat, then why on earth are they still playing D&D when it has never actually meant this.  The only reason that the idea kinda sorta works is because the vast majority of healing has always been done through the magic system - either spells or magic items, so, the healing rates have never really been examined because they're almost never used.OTOH, my personal issue with healing surges is that they are very often asymmetrical and result in only a couple of characters controlling the pace of the game.  When your front line fighter gets down in healing surges, it's time to stop.  So, after a particular combat, you might have one PC down a bunch of surges, while the rest of the party is fine, but, you stop anyway because you want to keep that character alive.It's been a running joke in our Dark Sun game that my warlock needs to get in combat more.  In 15 levels, he's hardly ever taken any damage, simply because the group has a lot of fighter defender types.  They're getting beaten like a piñata, while I'm sitting back firing off at range.  I'm just to pretty to get into combat is my excuse.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />  But, it does get a bit weird when we have to rest because of one or two characters, rather than a group considering one of the reasons for 4e style healing was to get rid of the 15 MAD.  But, now instead of stopping because the cleric is out of healing, we're stopping because the fighter is out of surges.</blockquote>

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