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Message: <blockquote data-quote="JackSmithIV" data-source="post: 4666917" data-attributes="member: 74901">I'd like to put in my two cents on the whole tiefling demon-touched association to the rape argument.First off, tieflings are products of their ancestors' pact with infernal powers. Now, I haven't delved deeply into Bael Turrath lore, but I'm pretty sure they don't mention rape once. I think concensual relations with devils is entirely reasonable for a group of ancient nobility who sought infernal power. Even such, I am not very well read in this section of the lore, but an important thing to note is that while you can make this association, Wizards does not. The core rules imply that the ancestors made whatever pacts they did out of greed lust, and that there was a magical taint (bodies warped by magic, not genetic interspecies offspring). My mind doesn't really go from there to rape.But even so, lets say they did. Lets say there was a whole lot of charms and domination going on. What's important is that it's about imagery, and while I'm not trying to say that kind of rape is better or worse than another, I will go out on a limb enough to say that one certainly stands out and offends the senses more. If I hear that a person is a tiefling because their wealthy father fell into the charms of a succubus and impregnated her, only to realize it cost him his soul, I'll think "Wow, that's kinda screwed. Good story". If I hear that my person is a half orc because a tribe came to town, burned down the barns, raised the crops, killed the animals and children and raped the women, a very real part of me goes "Wow, that's a visceral and unneccessary bit of lore that I don't want in my core game world". I understand other groups find it to be fine. For that, there is nothing wrong. But for me, it is not, and it's completely where  draw the line in the sand. It would offend my sensibilities if Wizards included rape as part of the core, not because I expect them to go easy on me, not because I want them to censor their material, but for all of the same reasons that have been explored already in this thread. Why? Because domination and charms do not cross the line for me. Does that mean I condone date rape? Absolutely not. But it's a magical, fantastical kind of element that doesn't make me squeem for the same reason that killing 1000 orcs doesn't make me squeem like killing 1000 innocent villagers.</blockquote>

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