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<blockquote data-quote="tetrasodium" data-source="post: 7917996" data-attributes="member: 93670">They also pretty much stop at third, there are zero ritual spells of levels 4,7,8, &amp; 9 with the remaining 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th, &amp; 6th level rituals being too niche &amp; scattered to build much of a concept around other than &quot;like a sorcerer but occasionally&nbsp; casts detect magic &amp; tiny hut&quot;.&nbsp; Nobody is remarking about how the wizard's earlier cast/residual force multiplying rituals really saved Alice's bacon or that it's great how they let Bob wtfpn the bbeg so good or anything..It proves that the &quot;more spells!!&quot;/&quot;93!!&quot; argument is lacking enough substance to support the weight being attached to it.&nbsp; It does that by proving that there are spells that are deliberately overtuned outside the range of that spell's level &amp; it proves it with an official admission.&nbsp; As a result of that proof,&nbsp; &quot;bigger spell list&quot; as opposed to a slightly smaller list along with lots of early mid &amp; late class features and archtype features with a more valuable casting stat needs more depth than just &quot;more spells&quot; even if there are 93 of them in order for the &quot;more spells&quot; point to hold the weight people were trying to give it when they made it. I pointed out a problem that hurt the argument's merit &amp; asked for supporting details that could lend it the merit they were attaching to it, was doubted that it existed at all, provided proof of my doubt being intentional choice from wotc, and still rather than supporting their own weak argument watching the people who made it backpedal into &quot;it doesn't matter.&quot;[USER=63508]@Minigiant[/USER] the dresdenverse is a deep hole of lore upon lore , I just thought it was a silly tangent &amp; tried to end it&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin&nbsp; &nbsp; :D"&nbsp; data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /></blockquote>

[QUOTE="tetrasodium, post: 7917996, member: 93670"] They also pretty much stop at third, there are zero ritual spells of levels 4,7,8, & 9 with the remaining 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th, & 6th level rituals being too niche & scattered to build much of a concept around other than "like a sorcerer but occasionally casts detect magic & tiny hut". Nobody is remarking about how the wizard's earlier cast/residual force multiplying rituals really saved Alice's bacon or that it's great how they let Bob wtfpn the bbeg so good or anything. . It proves that the "more spells!!"/"93!!" argument is lacking enough substance to support the weight being attached to it. It does that by proving that there are spells that are deliberately overtuned outside the range of that spell's level & it proves it with an official admission. As a result of that proof, "bigger spell list" as opposed to a slightly smaller list along with lots of early mid & late class features and archtype features with a more valuable casting stat needs more depth than just "more spells" even if there are 93 of them in order for the "more spells" point to hold the weight people were trying to give it when they made it. I pointed out a problem that hurt the argument's merit & asked for supporting details that could lend it the merit they were attaching to it, was doubted that it existed at all, provided proof of my doubt being intentional choice from wotc, and still rather than supporting their own weak argument watching the people who made it backpedal into "it doesn't matter." [USER=63508]@Minigiant[/USER] the dresdenverse is a deep hole of lore upon lore , I just thought it was a silly tangent & tried to end it :D [/QUOTE]

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