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Message: <blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 9316889" data-attributes="member: 6790260">Here's the list, with explanations/thematics, if that would be more relevant to you. Again, first the existing ones; both lists lightly edited from the original post.[SPOILER]<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Artificer, the engineer-as-magician, with shades of other professional fields (blacksmith, surgeon, sapper, etc.), where craft-ken is magic</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Barbarian, the warrior-of-passion, whether it be warp-spasms or altered states of consciousness or spirit-indwelling.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Bard, the artist-as-magician, whether that art be music, dance, oratory, fencing, whatever--the magic of the fine and performing arts.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Cleric, the devotee-as-magician, servant and shepherd both, remembering that a shepherd's crook was both tool and weapon.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Druid, (these days) merging shapeshifter-as-magician and geomancer-as-magician, calling on the magic of land and beast.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Fighter, the warrior-of-skill, who transcends the limits of IRL mundane soldiers through grit and tenacity.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Monk, the warrior-of-discipline, who transcends limits through enlightenment and practiced form, often semi-spiritual in nature.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Paladin, the warrior-of-devotion, power manifest through purity, both in keeping promises and in inspiring others by their example.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Ranger, the warrior-of-the-hunt, who straddles the line between man and beast, city and wilderness, tools and nature.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Rogue, the warrior-of-trickery, who knows the ways of not being struck or spotted, and of striking and seeing, of locks and keys.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Sorcerer, the inheritor-as-magician, who has magic power not because it was sought, but because it is part of who they are.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Warlock, the bargainer-as-magician, who represents the power of Faustian bargains and clever swindlers cheating evil powers.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Wizard, the scientist-as-magician, who represents pure knowledge unlocking ultimate power, the deep secrets of reality.</li> </ul>[/SPOILER]And here's the ones I think should exist. Not in any particular order, this is just my spitballed order.[SPOILER]<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Assassin, the warrior-of-shadow, whose skill with all the subtle ways to stalk (and un-alive) someone transcends mortal limits.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Warlord, the warrior-of-tactics, who transcends limits by cooperating with others rather than purely through her own mettle.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Swordmage, the warrior-as-magician, for whom swordplay is magic, and magic is swordplay (or other weapons), one and inseparable.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Shaman, the spiritualist-as-magician, who straddles the line between material and spirit, the bridge connecting these realms.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Psion (etc.), the telepath-as-magician, who draws on ESP, the paranormal, occult "science" etc. to bend the rules of reality in their favor.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Alchemist, the chemist-as-magician, who uses magical ingredients and concoctions to control the world...or themselves.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Avenger, the warrior-of-zeal, whose absolute focus is both shield and sword against their enemies, who executes the turncoat apostate.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Warden, the warrior-of-the-land, who wears Nature's power like a cloak, and wreaks Her wrath where he walks.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Summoner, the overseer-as-magician, whose magic lies in getting other beings to use magic for her.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Invoker, the emissary-as-magician, who calls down disaster upon the foes of the faith, Elijah calling fire down against the altar of Baal.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">"Machinist" (not my fav name), the warrior-of-technology, who uses guns, machines, and tools to overcome their foes.</li> </ul>[/SPOILER]Some of these things are closer together than others, that's just how archetypes work. It's not a science, we don't carve up the spectrum into perfectly equal chunks. Colors work the same way.Note, also, that all of these have existed in either 3.5e, 4e, or PF1e--and usually at least two of those three.And, finally...as I said upthread, classes are not made for all people. I get that some folks have zero or even negative interest in, for example, an independent Warlord class or an independent Psion class. But there are enough people out there who really, really want those things, that I can't justify telling them "nope, sorry, the way is shut."</blockquote>

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