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Oops, Players Accidentally See Solution to Exploration Challenge
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<blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 7888684" data-attributes="member: 16814"><p>Well, the single sentence you snipped above was part of a broader context (or paragraph) that made it clear that I did understand your bolded line as part of your current argument, but that you had previously (or your argument was) less nuanced. Hence the reference to moving the goalposts, which was the lead sentence (often construed as a topic sentence) for the paragraph you strip-mined above.</p><p></p><p>And, yes, I fully understood your second para above, which is why I mentioned that it's refuting a strawman of the argument actually made, nicely summarized by the original poster of that argument above.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, you create a series of strawmen, here. Firstly, yes, it's possible to select a method that selects options absent information, but the choice to use that method is not independent of knowledge. IE, if my goal is to select the best reward, which I know it in that box, I could choose to roll a die and that method will make a selection absent the knowledge I have, but I would not be selecting that method absent the knowledge I have. I would, in fact, only select such a method, one that does not align with my goal, only if I actually had a different goal in mind when I made the selection. In which case we're not discussing a situation where my goal is actually to select the best box for me, so knowledge of which box is best is still informing my decision of method because I'm trying to achieve a different goal in spite of that knowledge.</p><p></p><p>As for the judicial or adminstrative process, sure, expect your example of additional knowledge is knowledge outside of that process. If you gain knowledge that actually directly impacts your process, ie germane to the facts of the case, then that must be considered if only to choose, with that knowledge in mind, how to proceed. You might choose to continue to use the same process despite the adverse effect of the knowledge, but you cannot do so absent that knowledge any longer -- your choice's fulcrum is that knowledge.</p><p></p><p>And, finally, your example of an administrative process is not playing a game. It's goal is a repeatable, consistent set of decisions, which it selects for continuously with knowledge of the case. In a game, your goal is set by the player. Proposing that you should use an inflexible choice making process to achieve that goal rather than the status of the fiction is ridiculous. Possible, sure, but no one's saying that you can't be ridiculous, just that it's ridiculous and against the goals of an RPG, which is to advocate for your character, or the story, both of which are impacted by knowledge the player has, inextricably so.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ovinomancer, post: 7888684, member: 16814"] Well, the single sentence you snipped above was part of a broader context (or paragraph) that made it clear that I did understand your bolded line as part of your current argument, but that you had previously (or your argument was) less nuanced. Hence the reference to moving the goalposts, which was the lead sentence (often construed as a topic sentence) for the paragraph you strip-mined above. And, yes, I fully understood your second para above, which is why I mentioned that it's refuting a strawman of the argument actually made, nicely summarized by the original poster of that argument above. Again, you create a series of strawmen, here. Firstly, yes, it's possible to select a method that selects options absent information, but the choice to use that method is not independent of knowledge. IE, if my goal is to select the best reward, which I know it in that box, I could choose to roll a die and that method will make a selection absent the knowledge I have, but I would not be selecting that method absent the knowledge I have. I would, in fact, only select such a method, one that does not align with my goal, only if I actually had a different goal in mind when I made the selection. In which case we're not discussing a situation where my goal is actually to select the best box for me, so knowledge of which box is best is still informing my decision of method because I'm trying to achieve a different goal in spite of that knowledge. As for the judicial or adminstrative process, sure, expect your example of additional knowledge is knowledge outside of that process. If you gain knowledge that actually directly impacts your process, ie germane to the facts of the case, then that must be considered if only to choose, with that knowledge in mind, how to proceed. You might choose to continue to use the same process despite the adverse effect of the knowledge, but you cannot do so absent that knowledge any longer -- your choice's fulcrum is that knowledge. And, finally, your example of an administrative process is not playing a game. It's goal is a repeatable, consistent set of decisions, which it selects for continuously with knowledge of the case. In a game, your goal is set by the player. Proposing that you should use an inflexible choice making process to achieve that goal rather than the status of the fiction is ridiculous. Possible, sure, but no one's saying that you can't be ridiculous, just that it's ridiculous and against the goals of an RPG, which is to advocate for your character, or the story, both of which are impacted by knowledge the player has, inextricably so. [/QUOTE]
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