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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 4723866" data-attributes="member: 82106">Yeah, it is absolutely clear, invisibility makes you IMMUNE to OAs. Being hidden has nothing to do with it.To make the other situations more clear, if someone is invisible and not hidden you know what square(s) they are in. Thus you can attack the square (-5 to hit), you don't need to make a perception check to do that. In fact there is NO benefit to making a perception check against a non-hidden invisible enemy.If an enemy IS hidden and invisible then you can make a perception check, minor action, to overcome their stealth and determine which square(s) they are in. Once you do that you can attack them (again with a -5 to-hit penalty). At that point they ARE no longer hidden from you, although the hidden creature could subsequently move and hide again.You can also ALWAYS target a square instead of a specific creature with an attack. It will be a -5 to-hit penalty. This is useful for playing "sub-search" with hidden invisible opponents, or opponents behind total cover. The DM should roll the to-hit in these cases and just tell the player if it was a hit or a miss so that the roll can't reveal whether or not there is even a target in the square (if not then the attack is an automatic miss, you don't want the player to know that). Pretty much all the same considerations apply to being hidden WITHOUT invisibility. Enemies can always target your square, though in general they will be simply guessing if you are there or not. OA is also not possible against a hidden target since being hidden means you are "invisible to the enemy". There is a slight ambiguity however. Suppose you are hidden next to an enemy and you move away. Moving more than 2 squares forces a new stealth check, but at the instant you start moving, you haven't yet moved (and might not even move 2 squares), so does the enemy get an OA? It isn't really clear. There are a few ways a DM could rule. 1) There is no possibility of an OA if you are moving less than 3 squares. 2) There is no possibility of an OA at all because you have not YET moved more than 2 squares. Furthermore does it depend on whether or not you are breaking cover? The gist of it is, at what point in your action do you become not hidden, and at what point in a move action where you move more than 2 squares do you become not hidden?</blockquote>

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