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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 7633224" data-attributes="member: 4937">You seem to be continuing some debate I wasn't a part of based on the idea that I am continuing it.&nbsp; But did I say I didn't know such a debate happened?&nbsp; Where do you get that of all things?You aren't saying anything I don't know.&nbsp; I'm just not sure how what you are saying is applicable or why you think it is.&nbsp;&nbsp; If in fact you have the archived words of Gygax where he says something useful on this subject, share them.&nbsp; If in fact you encountered some sort of consistent universally applied skill system preexisting the introduction of the thief which wasn't just DM fiat, please explain how that worked.&nbsp; I'd love to meet that mythical beast.&nbsp;&nbsp; Let's add another bit of evidence to that.&nbsp; I've been on the boards what 17 years now, and in that time not one OD&amp;D player has advocated for a skill system as opposed to DM fiat, despite the fact we've had plenty of grognards that play &quot;the one true system&quot;.&nbsp;&nbsp; So yeah, it's an assumption by me that such a skill system didn't exist, but I think it's a pretty strong assumption.And if you hadn't in fact encountered that consistent universally applied skill system used even by anyone much less a majority of the community, then you aren't actually contradicting me and you whole post amounts to nothing more than, &quot;Oh yeah.&nbsp; Well shut up.&quot;</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 7633224, member: 4937"] You seem to be continuing some debate I wasn't a part of based on the idea that I am continuing it. But did I say I didn't know such a debate happened? Where do you get that of all things? You aren't saying anything I don't know. I'm just not sure how what you are saying is applicable or why you think it is. If in fact you have the archived words of Gygax where he says something useful on this subject, share them. If in fact you encountered some sort of consistent universally applied skill system preexisting the introduction of the thief which wasn't just DM fiat, please explain how that worked. I'd love to meet that mythical beast. Let's add another bit of evidence to that. I've been on the boards what 17 years now, and in that time not one OD&D player has advocated for a skill system as opposed to DM fiat, despite the fact we've had plenty of grognards that play "the one true system". So yeah, it's an assumption by me that such a skill system didn't exist, but I think it's a pretty strong assumption. And if you hadn't in fact encountered that consistent universally applied skill system used even by anyone much less a majority of the community, then you aren't actually contradicting me and you whole post amounts to nothing more than, "Oh yeah. Well shut up." [/QUOTE]

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