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<blockquote data-quote="woodelf" data-source="post: 2167798" data-attributes="member: 10201"><p>Well, first off, it could be argued that there are several others already out there. I'd say <em>Blue Rose</em> pretty much fits into that vein. Ditto <em>Everquest D20</em> and <em>Grim Tales</em>. IMHO, all are basically taking the idea of D&D and retooling it with a whole new set of widgets. Yes, both have a new spellcasting mechanism, but that'd still be compatible with "standard" monsters and adventures and so on, at least for the most part. And unlike Conan D20, Black Company D20, Wheel of Time D20, or several others, they don't feel like they're trying to be a ruleset for a specific setting so much as a pseudo-generic ruleset, much like D&D3[.5]E (which isn't all that generic, either).</p><p></p><p>As for others i'd like to see: anything done by a good RPG designer who generally focuses her energies in other directions. Someone whose usual RPG output is significnatly different from the usual D20 System fare would be interesting to see do a serious job at some d20 System design. What would a "variant" of D&D done with D20 System look like if Robin Laws did it? Or George Vasilakos? Or John Wick? I think the fresh look at D20 System, and likely broken assumptions that ensued, would be really cool to see.</p><p></p><p>One that's on my project list is a ruleset that's social-centric, rather than combat-centric. In most of the current "versions" of D&D discussed in this thread, the system is built around violent/physical encounters and challenges. The classes are most-carefully balanced for that style of play (i.e., "adventuring" in the D&D sense), and it's in those areas where it's made sure no one is left out. So, it's combat (BAB & hps) that everyone gets better at, regardless of class, and even the poorest BAB progression is much closer to the best than in previous editions. There's less concern for other skills, where it's quite possible to have a high-level character with essentially zero ability in an area covered by a skill. And, of course, in wildly different set-ups, the class balance pretty much goes away: put a group of characters built with D&D3E, Everquest D20, or even Arcana Unearthed into a court-intrigue setting, where violence is never an option, and magic use is strictly controlled and limited, and suddenly several of the classes have nothing to do, others are badly nerfed, and only a few classes have directly-applicable abilities. </p><p></p><p>So, I'd like to reverse this, and start with the assumption that in the zero-violence, regulated-magic, minimal-physicality setting, all the classes are equal. Not that there would be no combat-capable classes, but that those abilities would be considered secondary (or even tertiary), and balanced appropriately. So everyone would get better at social stuff with increased level, and the feats would be focused around those sorts of challenges/abilities, and skills would take care of combat and physical stuff. I've got some working notes, and even used a variant for a convention game (albeit one in a very unusual setting, fairly low-tech, highly urban and social) which went pretty well. Now i've just gotta finish up the other 3 things ahead of it on the "to do" list.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="woodelf, post: 2167798, member: 10201"] Well, first off, it could be argued that there are several others already out there. I'd say [i]Blue Rose[/i] pretty much fits into that vein. Ditto [i]Everquest D20[/i] and [i]Grim Tales[/i]. IMHO, all are basically taking the idea of D&D and retooling it with a whole new set of widgets. Yes, both have a new spellcasting mechanism, but that'd still be compatible with "standard" monsters and adventures and so on, at least for the most part. And unlike Conan D20, Black Company D20, Wheel of Time D20, or several others, they don't feel like they're trying to be a ruleset for a specific setting so much as a pseudo-generic ruleset, much like D&D3[.5]E (which isn't all that generic, either). As for others i'd like to see: anything done by a good RPG designer who generally focuses her energies in other directions. Someone whose usual RPG output is significnatly different from the usual D20 System fare would be interesting to see do a serious job at some d20 System design. What would a "variant" of D&D done with D20 System look like if Robin Laws did it? Or George Vasilakos? Or John Wick? I think the fresh look at D20 System, and likely broken assumptions that ensued, would be really cool to see. One that's on my project list is a ruleset that's social-centric, rather than combat-centric. In most of the current "versions" of D&D discussed in this thread, the system is built around violent/physical encounters and challenges. The classes are most-carefully balanced for that style of play (i.e., "adventuring" in the D&D sense), and it's in those areas where it's made sure no one is left out. So, it's combat (BAB & hps) that everyone gets better at, regardless of class, and even the poorest BAB progression is much closer to the best than in previous editions. There's less concern for other skills, where it's quite possible to have a high-level character with essentially zero ability in an area covered by a skill. And, of course, in wildly different set-ups, the class balance pretty much goes away: put a group of characters built with D&D3E, Everquest D20, or even Arcana Unearthed into a court-intrigue setting, where violence is never an option, and magic use is strictly controlled and limited, and suddenly several of the classes have nothing to do, others are badly nerfed, and only a few classes have directly-applicable abilities. So, I'd like to reverse this, and start with the assumption that in the zero-violence, regulated-magic, minimal-physicality setting, all the classes are equal. Not that there would be no combat-capable classes, but that those abilities would be considered secondary (or even tertiary), and balanced appropriately. So everyone would get better at social stuff with increased level, and the feats would be focused around those sorts of challenges/abilities, and skills would take care of combat and physical stuff. I've got some working notes, and even used a variant for a convention game (albeit one in a very unusual setting, fairly low-tech, highly urban and social) which went pretty well. Now i've just gotta finish up the other 3 things ahead of it on the "to do" list. [/QUOTE]
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