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Overuse of monsters and magic.
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<blockquote data-quote="Valiant" data-source="post: 3778649" data-attributes="member: 54792"><p>Q: "I disagree with how unilateral your assertions are." My assertion was not unilateral, despite your attempt to label it so. Infact, thats why I supplied specific examples of the kind of thing I was talking about (dragons reduced to steeds (or have you ever played the Dragon Lance series, yuk!, and light spells lighting up city streets at night (see TLG's CZ1 for example). Sure, some magic is "common" for casters, but those are spells. In a low magic campaign, finding that flame tounge should make your mouth water, not yawn. Infact, in 1E most classes (like fighters for instance) start about the same (with no skills or feats remember) individuality of 1E fighters often involves the rare piece of magic they find and use that helps destinguish it from all the others. For instance, I once had a thief with a flame tounge sword (found at around 4th). He used it in all kinds of situations sometimes creatively, sometimes foolhardedly....thats the sort of thing that really gave this PC depth.</p><p>Really, its not unlike Biblo Baggins finding the ring of invisibility in the Hobbit (before you know its the "one ring of power"). His use of the ring to save the dwarves several times destinguished him really. And because he found it risking his life, it gives it a more meaningful value then if he'd purchased it. </p><p></p><p>The point of playing a fantasy game is to experiance the fantasy setting afterall. When module writers try to wow their players by throwing in novelty for the sake of being different, which often includes the kitchen sink then the setting suffers in the long run. Esp. when it becomes a competition for "novelty". One example of this can be seen in 3E when first they introduced one half this and half that, and then when people got bored with that introduced another 1/3 this 1/3 that 1/3 that, and then to "one up" that one we eventually ended up with the most obsured mixes to the point monster archetypes are becoming second place citizens in the classic fantasy setting. And once all these new monster combo's with odd class combinations become "ordinary" and there is nothing left to make novel, the game implodes upon itself (infact anything novel driven dies the same death). Late 1E/2E did this sort of thing, and so did 3E. I imagine 4E will follow the same path. The only ones that kept a handle on this was Gygax in OD&D and early 1E (before the shiat hit the fan at TSR).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Valiant, post: 3778649, member: 54792"] Q: "I disagree with how unilateral your assertions are." My assertion was not unilateral, despite your attempt to label it so. Infact, thats why I supplied specific examples of the kind of thing I was talking about (dragons reduced to steeds (or have you ever played the Dragon Lance series, yuk!, and light spells lighting up city streets at night (see TLG's CZ1 for example). Sure, some magic is "common" for casters, but those are spells. In a low magic campaign, finding that flame tounge should make your mouth water, not yawn. Infact, in 1E most classes (like fighters for instance) start about the same (with no skills or feats remember) individuality of 1E fighters often involves the rare piece of magic they find and use that helps destinguish it from all the others. For instance, I once had a thief with a flame tounge sword (found at around 4th). He used it in all kinds of situations sometimes creatively, sometimes foolhardedly....thats the sort of thing that really gave this PC depth. Really, its not unlike Biblo Baggins finding the ring of invisibility in the Hobbit (before you know its the "one ring of power"). His use of the ring to save the dwarves several times destinguished him really. And because he found it risking his life, it gives it a more meaningful value then if he'd purchased it. The point of playing a fantasy game is to experiance the fantasy setting afterall. When module writers try to wow their players by throwing in novelty for the sake of being different, which often includes the kitchen sink then the setting suffers in the long run. Esp. when it becomes a competition for "novelty". One example of this can be seen in 3E when first they introduced one half this and half that, and then when people got bored with that introduced another 1/3 this 1/3 that 1/3 that, and then to "one up" that one we eventually ended up with the most obsured mixes to the point monster archetypes are becoming second place citizens in the classic fantasy setting. And once all these new monster combo's with odd class combinations become "ordinary" and there is nothing left to make novel, the game implodes upon itself (infact anything novel driven dies the same death). Late 1E/2E did this sort of thing, and so did 3E. I imagine 4E will follow the same path. The only ones that kept a handle on this was Gygax in OD&D and early 1E (before the shiat hit the fan at TSR). [/QUOTE]
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