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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Fanaelialae" data-source="post: 4899683" data-attributes="member: 53980">I suppose it makes a kind of sense if you skin it as stress, though I had to chuckle a bit at the thought of a pacifist paralyzed by guilt because he caused a bloodthirsty orc undue stress.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />I just mean that if you have sleep act as damage, the pacifist healer feat works fine.  Every time you hit an enemy who is bloodied with your sleep spell you are stunned.  It's a bit weird but mechanically it works, since the healing bonus from that feat is crazy good (and thus requires a significant drawback, which it provides).  If you reduce the penalty for attacks with the pacification keyword (like only triggering it on the final blow) you significantly downplay the penalty, making that feat a no-brainer for any pacifist.Alternately, reduce the bonus healing from pacifist healer and reduce the penalty as well.  Off the top of my head, I'd say that if you want to reduce the penalty to "stunned on a finishing blow", reduce the healing to just Charisma modifier (lose the d6s).I understand where you're coming from.  Even in 3.x and 2nd ed my group and I did our best to steer clear of save-or-die/save-or-suck effects by silent and unanimous agreement.  We always felt they were very boring when they worked, and a waste of a resources when they didn't.  I haven't had to deal with the save-or-X effects in 4e yet, since it seems my players still tend to avoid them like the plague.</blockquote>

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