Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Paladin Behavior?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Voadam" data-source="post: 1801564" data-attributes="member: 2209"><p>The designers of the game stated their goal was to balance the classes mechanically and the restrictions on alignment, switching classes, and the paladin restrictions were not mechanical balancing factors but flavor issues to capture the history of the classes as they have been in the past. Removing the roleplay restrictions and alignment restrictions would change the flavor of the classes but not make the formerly restricted classes overpower the non-restricted ones. A lawful berserker will not be unbalanced mechanically nor a lawful bard.</p><p></p><p>IME this is the case, a paladin is fairly balanced against a fighter or a wizard of equal level as far as adventuring usefulness. The restrictions are just roleplay issues.</p><p></p><p>So the cost will have to be in flavor. Now removing the restrictions can be viewed as diluting the concepts of the classes if you view the restrictions as a significant part of the class, for instance chaotic and barbarian. So a lawful barbarian pays the price for diluting the concept by mechanically losing rage.</p><p></p><p>However if you feel that the class concept is not based in the restrictions but elsewhere such as the class abilities and archetypes, then removing the restrictions opens up new character concept possibilities such as a berserker who is lawful because he follows a code, is devoted to his liege lord and his people, and believes in groups over individuals and the rule of law. Drunken Master style monks seem better suited to chaos than law, etc. Viewed this way the character gets his non core supported concept in a mechanically balanced package, and so there should not be a cost if the character is to remain mechanically balanced.</p><p></p><p>As it stands this is not the case, there are these restrictions and so there are these mechanically unbalanced consequences to breaking the restrictions (a fallen paladin is basically equivalent to an NPC class warrior, a lawful barbarian loses the significant class power of rage, etc.)</p><p></p><p>When I play a hero I just want to play a hero, I don't want to try to play someone else's view of what a hero should do or have the morality of my actions constantly judged for possible failure with someone else's differing standards. If there was a disagreement and I was penalized it would lessen my fun significantly. So I'm currently playing a LG war domain godless cleric in a current campaign instead of a paladin. Mechanically almost the same, and I can't think of a single thing I would do different roleplay-wise if he were a paladin, but no worries or judgments and I can focus on playing the character and enjoying the adventure instead of what the DM thinks a paladin should do in every situation. If the paladin restrictions were not there I would have considered playing a paladin, but as it stands I don't ever plan on playing one subject to those mechanical risks and constant DM moral judgments.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Voadam, post: 1801564, member: 2209"] The designers of the game stated their goal was to balance the classes mechanically and the restrictions on alignment, switching classes, and the paladin restrictions were not mechanical balancing factors but flavor issues to capture the history of the classes as they have been in the past. Removing the roleplay restrictions and alignment restrictions would change the flavor of the classes but not make the formerly restricted classes overpower the non-restricted ones. A lawful berserker will not be unbalanced mechanically nor a lawful bard. IME this is the case, a paladin is fairly balanced against a fighter or a wizard of equal level as far as adventuring usefulness. The restrictions are just roleplay issues. So the cost will have to be in flavor. Now removing the restrictions can be viewed as diluting the concepts of the classes if you view the restrictions as a significant part of the class, for instance chaotic and barbarian. So a lawful barbarian pays the price for diluting the concept by mechanically losing rage. However if you feel that the class concept is not based in the restrictions but elsewhere such as the class abilities and archetypes, then removing the restrictions opens up new character concept possibilities such as a berserker who is lawful because he follows a code, is devoted to his liege lord and his people, and believes in groups over individuals and the rule of law. Drunken Master style monks seem better suited to chaos than law, etc. Viewed this way the character gets his non core supported concept in a mechanically balanced package, and so there should not be a cost if the character is to remain mechanically balanced. As it stands this is not the case, there are these restrictions and so there are these mechanically unbalanced consequences to breaking the restrictions (a fallen paladin is basically equivalent to an NPC class warrior, a lawful barbarian loses the significant class power of rage, etc.) When I play a hero I just want to play a hero, I don't want to try to play someone else's view of what a hero should do or have the morality of my actions constantly judged for possible failure with someone else's differing standards. If there was a disagreement and I was penalized it would lessen my fun significantly. So I'm currently playing a LG war domain godless cleric in a current campaign instead of a paladin. Mechanically almost the same, and I can't think of a single thing I would do different roleplay-wise if he were a paladin, but no worries or judgments and I can focus on playing the character and enjoying the adventure instead of what the DM thinks a paladin should do in every situation. If the paladin restrictions were not there I would have considered playing a paladin, but as it stands I don't ever plan on playing one subject to those mechanical risks and constant DM moral judgments. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Paladin Behavior?
Top