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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Scupper" data-source="post: 945735" data-attributes="member: 2593">Um, not really.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f615.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":confused:" title="Confused    :confused:"  data-smilie="5"data-shortname=":confused:" /> Here's some logic: If the paladin is so specialized that it is unlike any other core class, then it follows that no other core class can adequately model the paladin class. Thus, people who want to play a paladin cannot, if it is made a prestige class.I think you are unclear on the definition of "logical." It does not mean "in accordance with my opinion." Show me the part of the paladin's code that says he cannot have suspicions, hunches, or simple misgivings about the legitimacy of a particular government. By your logic, no paladin could ever believe a system was corrupt, because to even look for corruption, he'd have to have a suspicion that the system was not legitimate. Where did I say he should lie? I said "withold information." Are you saying that a Paladin, asked about his past, cannot say "I prefer not to speak about my past?" Personally, I don't subscribe to such a cartoony view of paladins. They would be utter laughingstocks in anything other than open warfare.  What about a paladin asked "where is the secret chamber holding your order's most valuable artifact?" Is it inadmissable for him to withold information in that case? Do you know what a "policeman" is? What do you think the ratio of suspects shot and killed is to those brought in peacefully? Some people will actually surrender to authority that has the threat of force behind it rather than fight to the death. Note that I said "if your DM is being strict about alignment choices." If he is, then by definition a Lawful Good character does lawful and good things, otherwise his alignment shifts to one more appropriate for his actions.I think I didn't express this point very clearly. There isn't much difference, practically speaking, between playing any Lawful Good character and playing a Paladin, with respect to the moral choices your character must make. Even if you go by "three strikes" for the non-paladins, that's only two more strikes than a paladin gets. Not exactly a world of difference.I'd like to see lists of the hundreds of different druid, bard, and monk archetypes out there, but here's some Paladins off the top of my head:1) Diplomat (rogue/paladin)2) Honorable Guardsman 3) Questing Knight4) Travelling Justicar5) Spreader of the Faith (cleric/paladin)6) The Good King's Sword Arm7) The Fiend Hunter (ranger/paladin)8) Undead Slayer9) Fighting Chaplain (a paladin among fighters)10) Healer (Paladin/Cleric)11) Crusader against an enemy nation12) Champion of a Sacred Site13) Templar (Paladin/Cleric)14) The Redeemer (bring em back good, rather than dead)15) Orphan in search of his past16) Father in search of his lost family17) The Rebel against the Dictator18) The Cleanser of Corruption in his church19) The Warden of the Forest (ranger/pal) 20) Retriever of Lost RelicsEasy, because you can't have a Paladin. The idea behind the class of Paladin is that a person of unwavering faith and devotion to law and good taps into a force simply unavailable to those whose lives are anything less. Just because there is a force for good, there doesn't automatically have to be a corresponding one for evil, or vice versa. There's no "good" equivalent of a night hag.</blockquote>

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