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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ThirdWizard" data-source="post: 2778924" data-attributes="member: 12037">Because it changes from game to game. One game will have no options, another many. That has nothing at all to do with the system, and it has everything to do with the players. Saying that 2E has as many options as 3E is not true. Saying that many DMs gave the players many options is true. But, you can't attribute that to the game, you have to attribute it to the players playing the game.That can't be right. As far as I can see, its backwards. Without the rules, the stat block will be longer, not shorter. Take a simple feat like Dodge. If the rule exists (ie the feat) then you write Feats: Dodge somewhere. If the rule doesn't exist, then you write "can add +1 dodge bonus to AC against one opponent which can be changed on their turn."Any 1 line stat block will by definition not have these options because you have to spell them out. Give me a 1E fighter that can trip and disarm better than other fighters and can cleave and power attack. I guarantee you it will not be one line.Pining for the one line stat block is pining for less options available.I'm confusing nothing. Just because you saw fit to add rules to the game and call them options doesn't mean that there were the same number of options but less rules. House Rules are aptly named.And lets not confuse the issue. I'm talking about one line stat blocks, or three line stat blocks if we want to go wild. Could those PCs with "options" (ie new rules made up for them) be expressed in one to three lines? That is the real question here. I say, no, they couldn't. The more options you give the longer the stat block has to be to express said options. You seem to be reading some edition debate into what I'm saying.If, in fact, a 1E NPC could be written in one line, and nothing is missed, then it is, frankly, impossible to argue that the same options were present in 1E than 3.X, at least for NPCs. I'm saying that the longer stat block is a logical outgrowth of these added options.As an example of a "long" stat block here is an example from my last session: an elite guard mook who the PCs fought around two groups of four during the adventure (less than expected because of good tactics).[sblock]Elite Guard, Fighter 4: CR 4; Size M; HD 4d10; hp 28; Init +5; Spd 30 ft; AC 17, touch 12, flat footed 13; BAB +4, Grapple +6; Atck +8 melee (1d8+4 longsword), Atck +8 ranged (1d8+2 longbow); AL LN; SV: Fort +4, Refl +2, Will +0; Str 14, Dex 14, Con 10, Int 8, Wis 8, Cha 8.Skills & Feats: Spot +3, Listen +3; WF (ls), WS (ls), II, Combat Refl., Toughness, Dodge.Possessions: mw longsword, mighty longbow, chian shirt, heavy shield[/sblock]I can't imagine trying to cram that into one or two lines.EDIT:Of the options that I expressed here: As a guard they had quick reflexes to react to situations around them. To achieve this effect, I used the rules of Improved Initiative and Combat Reflexes. I also wanted them to be good with their particular melee weapons, so I gave them Focus and Specialization in the longsword. Since the PCs have the option to try to get the drop on the guards (using Move Silently and Hide) I decided to not only list the rules for their Spot and Listen, but also included their flat footed AC, along with touch since the PCs have the options to try to forgo saving throws and instead use touch attacks in their spells.</blockquote>

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