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<blockquote data-quote="Samurai" data-source="post: 4269011" data-attributes="member: 3850">As a player of a 3.5 character who has significant AoE powers, playing in a group where everyone else is a melee combatant, I've found that if you don't let loose with your big AoE power in round 1, chances are you're going to be hitting your allies too.&nbsp; Which means you don't have time to determine who is and isn't a minion, because like you said, on round 2 they are surrounding you.&nbsp; Really, from an in-game perspective, if 8 size Large Cyclops are rushing at you, there is about 6 seconds until they get to you and your friends, are you going to fire of a little at will power because as a player you know they must be minions, or are you going to let loose with your Daily power in the only opportunity you'll have without blasting your party as well, hoping to at least scare off the brutes before they pound you to mush?And, what if you thought they were minions and they weren't?&nbsp; The GM may have set up a very challenging fight for the party, using the assumption that the big AoE on round 1 would significantly weaken the opponents.&nbsp; But everyone assumed they were just minions, and so wasted a round just doing at wills!&nbsp; By the time they realized these were real foes, not minions, it was too late for the big guns because they'd closed to melee range.&nbsp; If there were some way before Epic levels to exclude allies from AoE, it would be much less of a problem (though you still basically wasted a round of attacks using the popguns instead of the big guns, which means you might as well have given them a full extra round of attacks...)What this means is that I will not be shocked at all if a significant number of Wizards (and others) use their big Daily powers expecting a tough battle aginst numerous foes, only to have them drop like flies.&nbsp; And to have other instances where players guess they are minions when they aren't, and waste a round doing at wills and minor attacks instead of pulling out the big gun to soften them up before they get to melee range.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Samurai, post: 4269011, member: 3850"] As a player of a 3.5 character who has significant AoE powers, playing in a group where everyone else is a melee combatant, I've found that if you don't let loose with your big AoE power in round 1, chances are you're going to be hitting your allies too. Which means you don't have time to determine who is and isn't a minion, because like you said, on round 2 they are surrounding you. Really, from an in-game perspective, if 8 size Large Cyclops are rushing at you, there is about 6 seconds until they get to you and your friends, are you going to fire of a little at will power because as a player you know they must be minions, or are you going to let loose with your Daily power in the only opportunity you'll have without blasting your party as well, hoping to at least scare off the brutes before they pound you to mush? And, what if you thought they were minions and they weren't? The GM may have set up a very challenging fight for the party, using the assumption that the big AoE on round 1 would significantly weaken the opponents. But everyone assumed they were just minions, and so wasted a round just doing at wills! By the time they realized these were real foes, not minions, it was too late for the big guns because they'd closed to melee range. If there were some way before Epic levels to exclude allies from AoE, it would be much less of a problem (though you still basically wasted a round of attacks using the popguns instead of the big guns, which means you might as well have given them a full extra round of attacks...) What this means is that I will not be shocked at all if a significant number of Wizards (and others) use their big Daily powers expecting a tough battle aginst numerous foes, only to have them drop like flies. And to have other instances where players guess they are minions when they aren't, and waste a round doing at wills and minor attacks instead of pulling out the big gun to soften them up before they get to melee range. [/QUOTE]

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