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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celtavian" data-source="post: 6559136" data-attributes="member: 5834">Not true at all. What game have you been playing? The barbarian in 3E was a beastly sick monster of a class in 3E. He looks damn good in this edition. What about the intelligence of the martial? If he's fighting a wizard, he doesn't show up with no means to do so. He brings a potion, finds a magic blade that gives him an edge, ambushes him, finds his own wizard allies. Do your martials do nothing?None of the martials I've run have ever been scenery. They've been parts of every adventure, highly involved in the role-play and combat. A martial sat on the throne in our Kingmaker campaign wielding Armag's Blade. He had a blast. The warrior general Kord could intimidate giant's with a glare because his intimidation skill was so high. The archer was a mobile destroyer that could track an ant through the forest.I don't know what you're looking for other than anime type of martials. Martials in D&D have done all kinds of amazing things that wizards can't accomplish as well or easily. Then there is the fact that the martials WANT to participate and can do so effectively. What do the wizards you run do? "I don't want you to use your social skills in this situation. I'm going to use charm because I don't like anyone else doing anything useful while I'm here. I have to do everything. You just stand around and wait to swing your sword when I tell you to do so. Thanks for coming."Is that really your D&D experience? Is that how you run the game? Man, if that is, no wonder you are complaining. Sorry, those things don't come up in my game. I make sure martials have fun. I build adventures to highlight their abilities both in and out of combat. I give them lots of cool, unique magic items that make them dangerous to fight for anyone. I don't play the game like you do. I never have. Thus I don't have the same problems. I like to follow quite a few genre conventions. Wizards are generally the mysterious, powerful types that pull out strange magic as needed to turn the tide of battle or overcome strange obstacles. Warriors are heroic, courageous, and capable of fighting hordes of creatures and powerful monsters in melee combat, usually armed with a legendary magical weapon. The masses fear and distrust wizards. They love and admire heroic warriors that do great deeds to protect them. Wizards end up in towers doing experiments and reading arcane tomes. Warriors get the chicks and have children in every village, town, and city. Martials are physically impressive specimens. Wizards are usually not (unless your Anomander Rake). There's lot of benefits to being a martial. That's why they're as popular to play as they are. Some of it is a choice of style. I have friends that rarely touch casters because they can't picture themselves as one. They love the image of the muscular, powerful heroic warrior with the greatsword going toe to toe in battle until they are covered in blood and their enemy lays on the ground before them. There is something primal about that to a lot of players. And there are variations on that theme whether it the rogue slitting a throat or the otherworldly monk avoiding blows and destroying opponents with martial arts or the archer planting arrows in an enemy's heart before they can get within a hundred feet of him. D&D does a good job of appealing to a wide array of genre conventions whether martials or casters. I use the system to let the players live out their current fantasy. I don't let a single caster player dominate everything because I'm such a poor DM I can't come up with ways to make non-casters shine. Whenever I hear the complaints, I think some players don't have DMs doing the same. That's too bad.</blockquote>

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