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Message: <blockquote data-quote="javcs" data-source="post: 3017620" data-attributes="member: 43677">The difference there is, the WoTC designers, and the vast majority of players would think an ECL of around 5 or 6 higher than the party for an 'overpowering' encounter ... not something where your characters would have difficulties on the saves even if they all had the epic paragon template applied to them. Alright, maybe I'm exagerating a bit, but with +14 save mod, applying the epic paragon boosts the save by 17 or 18 max, you're still not gonna get a DC 40 that often, the DC 25, yeah, it's easier, but last time I checked, DMs weren't supposed to assume that all of the PCs in their campaign had the paragon template ... I mean, I DM sometimes, and the closest thing to an instant kill that I remember doing was to a pixie rogue 4 who tried to walk through about 5 walls of fire and lighting ... that were wrapped around an inhospitable stronghold ... I digress ... and even that required about 5 reflex saves ... and she was fortunate enough to get reincarnated as a pixie again. I think that was in a level 10 campaign, the pixie had the +6 LA ... no idea why.Personally, I think he just made those numbers up when asked about it. And that trying to cut down the corpse was not something he'd thought of, so he ad-hoced the situation, which would explain the basic dread wraith ... as opposed to a customized one. Also that he didn't think about the effect that it'd have, or he was trying, and failing, to indicate that the party's goals lay elsewhere ... but, that entire situation stinks to me of something that you'd expect from a DIETY ... and a moderately powerful one, too ... in an epic campaign that had been going on for some time as epic.</blockquote>

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