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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FrogReaver" data-source="post: 9890175" data-attributes="member: 6795602">Then say what spell are you using, because most likely we can factor it in.  What I find is that most the time when spells are brought up, it's treated as spells doing everything all at once all the time and that they never take actions to cast.  That's just not the case.GWF is only +0.55 DPR.  Giving them defense added about 14 eHP.  It's such a minor tradeoff either way.  That proposed modification changes nothing due to the already overwhelming gap.A zealot can:Heal 5d12 = +118 eHPDamage + 6.5 * 0.84 = +5.5 DPR every single turn.If anything including subclasses is going to push the Fighter 3/Bard 3 even further behind.  And if we were being really fair instead of conservative, I should include GWM on the Barbarian as well.*Note: GWM adds about +4.3 DPR when BA attack on crit is also included.Yes, there are spell slots.  If you want to argue spells, that even just 4 level 1 slots and 2 level 2 slots trumps everything else, that's certainly a take.  But as I said at the start of this reply, if there's a specific spell you envision as making the Bard/Fighter definitively better than let's hear it.Ultimately though, if the main rebuttal is spells, then just compare to a single class Valor Bard = more spells, better spells, better damage, more uses of bardic inspiration since they recharge on a short rest along with getting ASI/Feat and better AC than your GWF change.</blockquote>

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