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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 8238118" data-attributes="member: 12731"><p>[USER=6778210]@Justice and Rule[/USER] : unfortunately you're just aiming for the easy targets here. I obviously already know how to describe a haunted house (or similar).</p><p></p><p>What I want to know, no, what I demand the rules tell me, is how a player is supposed to hear this description and go "hang on a minute, let me exorcise those spooky voices!"</p><p></p><p>How did you go from A to B here? </p><p></p><p>In other words, we're right back at square one. How are you supposed to avoid having to bring the meta out in the open? To not have to say "you can't possibly know this, but those malevolent images you see around you? You can <a href="https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=45" target="_blank">out-confound them</a>! By using Deception!"</p><p></p><p>And that's just a single example in a long, and increasingly absurd, list. </p><p></p><p>There just is no link given between what the characters see and what the players can do!</p><p></p><p>For instance, if you suddenly hear the spooky tunes of an unseen orchestra, what do you do?</p><p></p><p>Do you</p><p>a) scream at the top of your lungs to drown out the noise?</p><p>b) try to frighten the ghostly performers to stop?</p><p>c) just run away?</p><p>d) bring out an instrument of your own to play a happier tune, thus disabling the trap?</p><p>e) attack the ghosts with your magic weapon?</p><p>f) start to blather prayers in the hopes you can dispel the trap?</p><p>g) actually cast Dispel Magic to dispel the magic?</p><p></p><p>Only three of those are correct. And one is clearly better than the other two. I could just make up three answers and claim those are the correct ones, and you wouldn't be able to say I'm wrong - not unless you check the <a href="https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=48" target="_blank">statistics</a>, so I won't: the correct ways are b, d and f.</p><p></p><p>I see zero ways of knowing which is which, though. The description just doesn't provide enough to go from in-game description to "I roll Occultism!" for instance. And oh, Occultism actually does nothing against <a href="https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=48" target="_blank">this trap</a>. It would help against the <a href="https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=45" target="_blank">previously discussed trap</a>, though. </p><p></p><p>Again, I see no pattern. </p><p></p><p>I haven't the slightest idea of how my players are going to be able to take intelligent action against these traps. That to me is a problem.</p><p></p><p>Now tell me again how to use a haunt.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 8238118, member: 12731"] [USER=6778210]@Justice and Rule[/USER] : unfortunately you're just aiming for the easy targets here. I obviously already know how to describe a haunted house (or similar). What I want to know, no, what I demand the rules tell me, is how a player is supposed to hear this description and go "hang on a minute, let me exorcise those spooky voices!" How did you go from A to B here? In other words, we're right back at square one. How are you supposed to avoid having to bring the meta out in the open? To not have to say "you can't possibly know this, but those malevolent images you see around you? You can [URL='https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=45']out-confound them[/URL]! By using Deception!" And that's just a single example in a long, and increasingly absurd, list. There just is no link given between what the characters see and what the players can do! For instance, if you suddenly hear the spooky tunes of an unseen orchestra, what do you do? Do you a) scream at the top of your lungs to drown out the noise? b) try to frighten the ghostly performers to stop? c) just run away? d) bring out an instrument of your own to play a happier tune, thus disabling the trap? e) attack the ghosts with your magic weapon? f) start to blather prayers in the hopes you can dispel the trap? g) actually cast Dispel Magic to dispel the magic? Only three of those are correct. And one is clearly better than the other two. I could just make up three answers and claim those are the correct ones, and you wouldn't be able to say I'm wrong - not unless you check the [URL='https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=48']statistics[/URL], so I won't: the correct ways are b, d and f. I see zero ways of knowing which is which, though. The description just doesn't provide enough to go from in-game description to "I roll Occultism!" for instance. And oh, Occultism actually does nothing against [URL='https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=48']this trap[/URL]. It would help against the [URL='https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=45']previously discussed trap[/URL], though. Again, I see no pattern. I haven't the slightest idea of how my players are going to be able to take intelligent action against these traps. That to me is a problem. Now tell me again how to use a haunt. [/QUOTE]
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