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Pathfinder 2e: Actual Play Experience
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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 7825454" data-attributes="member: 12731"><p>Related to play experience: We finally grokked the rules for initiative and starting Encounters! (We're only six players with easily 120 years of experience between us, and it didn't take more than ten sessions for the penny to drop... <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p>Let's assume The Lurker is lying in ambush as the heroes move in single line through the forest (plenty of cover means Move Silently activity is available). McSneak and McBrawl is basing their Initiative on Stealth, McPray is just traipsing along (and also carrying the torch).</p><p></p><p>McSneak rolls (Stealth) Initiative 24 - he's the fastest!</p><p>The Lurker rolls (Stealth) Initiative 17</p><p>McPray rolls (Perception) Initiative 16</p><p>McBrawl rolls (Stealth) Initiative 16</p><p></p><p>Now then, PF2 brings several completely new and unfamiliar things (for us):</p><p></p><p>1) McSneak does <strong>not</strong> discover The Lurker: The Lurker's Stealth (17) beats McSneak's Perception DC (16) - McSneak's initiative has nothing to do with detecting stealthy foes.</p><p></p><p>2a) The Lurker doesn't discover McSneak: McSneak's Stealth (24) beats The Lurker's Perception DC (20)</p><p>2b) The Lurker discovers McPray (automatically)</p><p>2c) The Lurker does <strong>not</strong> spot McBrawl - it becomes aware of McBrawl's position, but McBrawl remains hidden from The Lurker! You need a stealthy foe to <strong>critfail</strong> to be fully revealed!</p><p></p><p>3) McPray becomes aware of The Lurker! Yes, he rolled only a 16 on initiative, but his Perception DC is 18, which The Lurker did not beat. McPray hears a twig snap or maybe the drooling of The Lurker or whatever.</p><p></p><p>4) McBrawl sees nothing, hears nothing</p><p></p><p>Now then, the first round of the encounter!</p><p></p><p>5) McSneak acts first, but has no reason to suspect danger. Having him spend three actions as if in combat feels totally off! (We admit we don't fully understand the RAI here, but we're running it as "he keeps exploring just as usual" for now. He moves forward at a cautious pace)</p><p></p><p>6) Then it is The Lurker. But from its POV the first party member is McPray/McBrawl, so it delays until there's food on the table. It's initiative is now, what?, 15 1/2?</p><p></p><p>7) The players agree McPray should act before McBrawl. McPray knows there's danger in them bushes, but can't target it!</p><p></p><p>7b) He Seeks and makes an "active" Perception Roll! He rolls a 8 and gets 16, worse than his "passive" score, and worse than The Lurker's Stealth check, but <strong>none of that matters</strong>! The Lurker's Stealth DC is only 16, and it goes from hidden to observed. But only by McPray!</p><p></p><p>7c) Should McPray now spend his second action to Point Out the enemy? No! That action can only ever make the enemy go from undetected -> hidden, never from hidden -> observed! He instead casts a spell or something.</p><p></p><p>7d) Now it's McBrawl! Not so fast! The Lurker knows the game is up, and jumps out to attack McPray!</p><p></p><p>Finally it becomes fully spotted/targetable by everyone!</p><p></p><p>And now (but not before) the combat resolves in pretty much the same fashion as you'd expect... <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite18" alt=":ROFLMAO:" title="ROFL :ROFLMAO:" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":ROFLMAO:" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 7825454, member: 12731"] Related to play experience: We finally grokked the rules for initiative and starting Encounters! (We're only six players with easily 120 years of experience between us, and it didn't take more than ten sessions for the penny to drop... ;) Let's assume The Lurker is lying in ambush as the heroes move in single line through the forest (plenty of cover means Move Silently activity is available). McSneak and McBrawl is basing their Initiative on Stealth, McPray is just traipsing along (and also carrying the torch). McSneak rolls (Stealth) Initiative 24 - he's the fastest! The Lurker rolls (Stealth) Initiative 17 McPray rolls (Perception) Initiative 16 McBrawl rolls (Stealth) Initiative 16 Now then, PF2 brings several completely new and unfamiliar things (for us): 1) McSneak does [B]not[/B] discover The Lurker: The Lurker's Stealth (17) beats McSneak's Perception DC (16) - McSneak's initiative has nothing to do with detecting stealthy foes. 2a) The Lurker doesn't discover McSneak: McSneak's Stealth (24) beats The Lurker's Perception DC (20) 2b) The Lurker discovers McPray (automatically) 2c) The Lurker does [B]not[/B] spot McBrawl - it becomes aware of McBrawl's position, but McBrawl remains hidden from The Lurker! You need a stealthy foe to [B]critfail[/B] to be fully revealed! 3) McPray becomes aware of The Lurker! Yes, he rolled only a 16 on initiative, but his Perception DC is 18, which The Lurker did not beat. McPray hears a twig snap or maybe the drooling of The Lurker or whatever. 4) McBrawl sees nothing, hears nothing Now then, the first round of the encounter! 5) McSneak acts first, but has no reason to suspect danger. Having him spend three actions as if in combat feels totally off! (We admit we don't fully understand the RAI here, but we're running it as "he keeps exploring just as usual" for now. He moves forward at a cautious pace) 6) Then it is The Lurker. But from its POV the first party member is McPray/McBrawl, so it delays until there's food on the table. It's initiative is now, what?, 15 1/2? 7) The players agree McPray should act before McBrawl. McPray knows there's danger in them bushes, but can't target it! 7b) He Seeks and makes an "active" Perception Roll! He rolls a 8 and gets 16, worse than his "passive" score, and worse than The Lurker's Stealth check, but [B]none of that matters[/B]! The Lurker's Stealth DC is only 16, and it goes from hidden to observed. But only by McPray! 7c) Should McPray now spend his second action to Point Out the enemy? No! That action can only ever make the enemy go from undetected -> hidden, never from hidden -> observed! He instead casts a spell or something. 7d) Now it's McBrawl! Not so fast! The Lurker knows the game is up, and jumps out to attack McPray! Finally it becomes fully spotted/targetable by everyone! And now (but not before) the combat resolves in pretty much the same fashion as you'd expect... :ROFLMAO: [/QUOTE]
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