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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Retreater" data-source="post: 8411326" data-attributes="member: 42040">Players usually don't have an awful time when an encounter is too easy. However, they remember when a mistake leads to character death(s). Sure, I've forgotten a few abilities for enemies and maybe didn't always play them like tactical geniuses. But the times when I did steamroll over parties, those few times really stand out. And if you do make a mistake like that, you risk ending your campaign in 2-3 rounds. But I can say that our bad experiences with PF2 didn't necessarily come from the challenge. I've run systems where combats can be deadly, such as Call of Cthulhu or any OSR variation. I think the main issue, across all the games I've played for the various groups, is that the system never got out of the way. It always felt like learning a simulation, even after months of play, whether in-person or online. Honestly, it felt like trying to graft roleplaying on top of Descent or Gloomhaven. I'm not saying groups can't have a great experience roleplaying in PF2 or that it's not fun. I enjoyed the heck out of 4e, but it's not a great system for roleplaying. Like PF2, when you have rules to make combats (or exploration) thrilling, mechanical affairs with lots of rules options, you run the risk of making those elements of the game to be a rules simulation that take away from immersion. I think that's my overall issue with PF2, 4e, and other systems like that. They just don't do what I want a roleplaying game to do.</blockquote>

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