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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Justice and Rule" data-source="post: 8412937" data-attributes="member: 6778210">This is a big part of how I play things, and how (despite being confusing due to the limitations of language) the stealth system is actually really good for this sort of thing. So you fail a Stealth check... in PF2, it's not suddenly over, but you go from unnoticed to undetected (Or as I would say, your opponent goes from unaware to aware). This only means that they think there is something in the vicinity with them, rather than having a good idea of what, where, or who. That isn't GM fiat, that's straight up what the rules are.Now we get to have room to roleplay, like [USER=7026314]@!DWolf[/USER] goes into: just being undetected means that a creature could have a variety of reactions, dependent on the situation: are they already in a combat situation? Are they on the look out for enemies? Are they in an area where they would expect other people? Is it a place where creatures (hostile or otherwise) sometimes get in? That all goes into the soft versus hard approach. If you have a terrorist securing a building who hears something, it might cause more problems because those NPCs would be on their guard and expecting hostiles. The above example shows when failing a stealth check might create a bit of tension, but not a full-on fail state: there's lots of reasons for the demon to approach this without being fully on guard, nor calling down reinforcements for no reason.The other half of this is something that is outline in the GMG but I guess is antithetical to how d20 games developed, so it gets forgotten. I think it's also in the DMG as well. But <a href="https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=818" target="_blank">failing forwards</a> is meant to be part of the game. Some of it is codified: it's hard to be immediately detected from Stealth, for example. In other parts, like in Knowledge Checks, it's meant to be done on a case-by-case basis. In this case, the Ranger has an opportunity to try other things, whether it be to try and continue sneaking, bluff, etc. It doesn't immediately devolve to combat.</blockquote>

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