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Pathfinder 2E or Pathfinder 1E?
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<blockquote data-quote="zztong" data-source="post: 7569720" data-attributes="member: 6943414"><p>One of my regular games is still working on the PF2 Playtest. The DM just sent out the message about how to update our characters for the last part. He also sent along the playtest goals, which we won't get to comment on because the playtest is complete. As I read through the questions, I feel I already have answers based on how things have gone so far in our playtesting...</p><p></p><p>> The primary playtest goals of this chapter are to learn whether the game still plays well at high level and to have fun!</p><p></p><p>Admirable goals.</p><p></p><p>> Do the rules for resolving combat get in the way of what should be an epic conclusion to the adventure?</p><p></p><p>I think the answer will be "yes" because they got in the way in the previous adventures. We've already ditched rules for Resonance, Bulk, and Hero Points. The Cleric healing options are spelled out in big letters on a whiteboard because those who have played the Cleric have often gotten tangled up in parsing the rules. Folks seem to be avoiding playing a character with a pet. Players are forgetting about their Reactions.</p><p></p><p>> Are there so many options for player characters that fights get bogged down and become relentless slogs?</p><p></p><p>Many players at the table already spend several minutes contemplating their actions and then just decide on "Move-Attack-Attack" either because they fail to figure out how the more complex rules work or because they conclude the alternatives aren't worth the effort.</p><p></p><p>> Are the PCs too powerful against their foes, or are those foes impossible to defeat?</p><p></p><p>Assuming the last adventure plays like the others, we'll wipe the floor with our opponents*. Only the first level adventure presented a legit combat challenge to us. Our DM knows most of the players don't care about the playtest goals and the DM has been trying to keep the game entertaining, thus modifying the encounters.</p><p></p><p>* The exception was the adventure with the Pirates/Besmara. We were told to make "roleplay characters" and folks didn't take magic weapons with their item purchases. So when the adventure turned out to have a mini-dungeon crawl, we weren't prepared (or able) to fight creatures our level. I had a guy designed to conceal daggers and even though my weapons were magical, I couldn't get through opposed DR. We only defeated the wizard opponent because he was caught in the same trap we were. We outlasted him. -- Of course, the DM probably made things work out for us to keep the story alive.</p><p></p><p>> With this edition of Pathfinder, we want to continue to make high-level play as enjoyable and as exciting as lower-level play—as it’s at the</p><p>> upper levels that campaigns come to a close and your memories of the finale of a long-running campaign should focus on the nail-biting final</p><p>> battles and confrontations against truly deadly foes.</p><p></p><p>I guess. I mean as a DM myself I certainly don't mind fostering the illusion that a climactic ending will be deadly and sow some feelings of tension and doubt. Honestly though, if it were "truly deadly" then there would be a significant chance of failure by the PCs and that is a [expletive] ending to a story for the players.</p><p></p><p>Anyways, I know this group will play PF2 because that'll be the DM's choice. I hope Paizo refines PF2 into something better than the playtest rules.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="zztong, post: 7569720, member: 6943414"] One of my regular games is still working on the PF2 Playtest. The DM just sent out the message about how to update our characters for the last part. He also sent along the playtest goals, which we won't get to comment on because the playtest is complete. As I read through the questions, I feel I already have answers based on how things have gone so far in our playtesting... > The primary playtest goals of this chapter are to learn whether the game still plays well at high level and to have fun! Admirable goals. > Do the rules for resolving combat get in the way of what should be an epic conclusion to the adventure? I think the answer will be "yes" because they got in the way in the previous adventures. We've already ditched rules for Resonance, Bulk, and Hero Points. The Cleric healing options are spelled out in big letters on a whiteboard because those who have played the Cleric have often gotten tangled up in parsing the rules. Folks seem to be avoiding playing a character with a pet. Players are forgetting about their Reactions. > Are there so many options for player characters that fights get bogged down and become relentless slogs? Many players at the table already spend several minutes contemplating their actions and then just decide on "Move-Attack-Attack" either because they fail to figure out how the more complex rules work or because they conclude the alternatives aren't worth the effort. > Are the PCs too powerful against their foes, or are those foes impossible to defeat? Assuming the last adventure plays like the others, we'll wipe the floor with our opponents*. Only the first level adventure presented a legit combat challenge to us. Our DM knows most of the players don't care about the playtest goals and the DM has been trying to keep the game entertaining, thus modifying the encounters. * The exception was the adventure with the Pirates/Besmara. We were told to make "roleplay characters" and folks didn't take magic weapons with their item purchases. So when the adventure turned out to have a mini-dungeon crawl, we weren't prepared (or able) to fight creatures our level. I had a guy designed to conceal daggers and even though my weapons were magical, I couldn't get through opposed DR. We only defeated the wizard opponent because he was caught in the same trap we were. We outlasted him. -- Of course, the DM probably made things work out for us to keep the story alive. > With this edition of Pathfinder, we want to continue to make high-level play as enjoyable and as exciting as lower-level play—as it’s at the > upper levels that campaigns come to a close and your memories of the finale of a long-running campaign should focus on the nail-biting final > battles and confrontations against truly deadly foes. I guess. I mean as a DM myself I certainly don't mind fostering the illusion that a climactic ending will be deadly and sow some feelings of tension and doubt. Honestly though, if it were "truly deadly" then there would be a significant chance of failure by the PCs and that is a [expletive] ending to a story for the players. Anyways, I know this group will play PF2 because that'll be the DM's choice. I hope Paizo refines PF2 into something better than the playtest rules. [/QUOTE]
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