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Pathfinder 2E or Pathfinder 1E?
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<blockquote data-quote="Ancalagon" data-source="post: 7591804" data-attributes="member: 23"><p>This is very true. The mechanism can either be used to restrain a few powerful spell to be used together (and then the impact is pretty limited) or, as you say, be very ruthless in its application.</p><p></p><p>The logic seems to be "a caster can only do one "big thing" at a time". And when I think about it, it's an action economy thing. If a control-focused wizard is suppressing a bunch of foes with say, hypnotic pattern, and then in the second round was to use another control spell while still using hypnotic pattern (ie there is no concentration), there are two consequences:</p><p></p><p>1. it's super powerful. Using a control spell to incapacitate half the foe is a fight winning move - or at least a fight evening move. But if you can just keep layering them on, by round 3 *every foe* is controlled, and that's just too much!</p><p></p><p>2: The action economy: In round 2, your are getting the action from round 1 "bleed" over to round 2! A fireball chucking wizard, or a fighter swinging her sword, they have to keep spending action to do things. It's not like "ok, the enemy takes 8d6 damage from my fireball, and another 8d6 from the fireball I tossed last round!". So concentration is the "price" you have to pay for having that action from round 1 persist. </p><p></p><p>I'm all for it because it imposes an important limit on what casters can do, but it also makes spell choice more important and interesting. What will you use your concentration slot on? What non-concentration spell do you have in your backpocket? Do you want to use your concentration on a movement spell, a defensive spell or a control spell? </p><p></p><p>Wizards can still layer defenses, but these defenses are not incredibly potent. You can have mirror image, mage armor and shield together, but no longer do you have these "haha I'm immune to everything" casters running around... and that's a good thing IMO</p><p></p><p>ANYWAY</p><p></p><p>To get back on pathfinder - they are using a concentration mechanism of sort, tied to the action economy (making explicit what 5e did). But, as you said, the real question will be how ruthless they are in applying this mechanism.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ancalagon, post: 7591804, member: 23"] This is very true. The mechanism can either be used to restrain a few powerful spell to be used together (and then the impact is pretty limited) or, as you say, be very ruthless in its application. The logic seems to be "a caster can only do one "big thing" at a time". And when I think about it, it's an action economy thing. If a control-focused wizard is suppressing a bunch of foes with say, hypnotic pattern, and then in the second round was to use another control spell while still using hypnotic pattern (ie there is no concentration), there are two consequences: 1. it's super powerful. Using a control spell to incapacitate half the foe is a fight winning move - or at least a fight evening move. But if you can just keep layering them on, by round 3 *every foe* is controlled, and that's just too much! 2: The action economy: In round 2, your are getting the action from round 1 "bleed" over to round 2! A fireball chucking wizard, or a fighter swinging her sword, they have to keep spending action to do things. It's not like "ok, the enemy takes 8d6 damage from my fireball, and another 8d6 from the fireball I tossed last round!". So concentration is the "price" you have to pay for having that action from round 1 persist. I'm all for it because it imposes an important limit on what casters can do, but it also makes spell choice more important and interesting. What will you use your concentration slot on? What non-concentration spell do you have in your backpocket? Do you want to use your concentration on a movement spell, a defensive spell or a control spell? Wizards can still layer defenses, but these defenses are not incredibly potent. You can have mirror image, mage armor and shield together, but no longer do you have these "haha I'm immune to everything" casters running around... and that's a good thing IMO ANYWAY To get back on pathfinder - they are using a concentration mechanism of sort, tied to the action economy (making explicit what 5e did). But, as you said, the real question will be how ruthless they are in applying this mechanism. [/QUOTE]
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