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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Windjammer" data-source="post: 8080625" data-attributes="member: 60075">There's potential for a good discussion of multi-classing across editions of D&D and PF but I'm not sure we've scratched more than the surface.To be fair, you could do 3.x-style multi-classing in 4E if you went versatile bard and did Paragon multi-classing. The problem wasn’t lack of flexibility but lack of effectiveness.I played a 4E bard drawing on 6+ classes who ended up being not versatile at all. Instead of being a Swiss Army Knife, Elvis was a ‘jack of no trades’ on the battle grid where hardly a roll landed. And that wasn’t the result of 4E’s piss poor multi-classing rules but the system’s relentless punishment of players who dared to build anything short of mono-stat PCs (where players focus their ability raises on one stat to stay on the Mearls math curve). This problem applied in moderation to dual-statted PCs but wrote versatile multi-classing out of the picture even though the option mechanically existed on paper.In true 4E fashion, the designers (Logan included?) next "fixed" this problem by writing a sh*t ton of feats that allowed you to use certain powers using YOUR primary stat instead of the power's scripted stat. Of course, the more of those feats you took, the less effective you were in other ways... and the fewer multi-classing you could do (which also required feats). It's 4E in a nut shell, where subsystems were rolled out in ways that didn't work and then patched in ways that ran directly counter to the issue to be fixed (here: how can I multiclass effectively).I think you could port 4E’s versatile bard multi-classing rules into PF2 with no problem. But having seen how super heavy PF2 penalizes non-optimized builds (see all the endless discussion of how hard it’s to build some advertised archetypes—like the goblin alchemist—that don’t suck all day long), you may run into the same difficulties 4E had. Not saying you always will, but PF2 is definitely a narrowly scripted class-build system like 4E Essentials was.</blockquote>

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