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<blockquote data-quote="ronaldsf" data-source="post: 8184234" data-attributes="member: 6672921">After having run a Level 20 short adventure with players who had several months of experience with PF2, I will say that there is a LOT to choose compared to other systems:-Ancestry, Heritage, 5 ancestry feats-Background-Class (and subclass if any)-10 or 11 class feats-5 general feats-10 Skill increases-10 skill feats-4 ability boosts each at L1, L5, L10, L15, L20-6 starting magic items plus 20,000gp extra to spend-Spellcasters getting ~33 cantrips+spells to useBut it would still be an academic exercise, because actually PLAYING a Level 20 character is what tripped players up. There were many, many options for their 3 actions and they only touched perhaps 30 percent of them in the course of 7 sessions. And there were many feats that modified how their basic abilities worked and/or triggered in response to events. They just didn't have the opportunity to organically &quot;learn&quot; their character over the course of 20 levels of play, and the fact that you grow horizontally with more options as you level up in PF2 (versus just getting numerical boosts and enhancements to your main actions/activities) means that you have a wealth of options but don't really know how to use them. And if you choose to carefully consider what you do every turn, play slows down to a crawl if you lack those 20 levels of actual play experience.<a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aUQAPC0p7PkoeN6WZT0gLNyDrik-lmAm/view?usp=sharing" target="_blank">Here is a link to my personal GM &quot;cheat sheet&quot; to manage that adventure</a>I'm not sure what you'd want to get out of making Level 20 characters when learning a new system: you enjoy character creation? Or you want to see what high-level play looks like perhaps? Quick character creation is not what you'll get with PF2! The strength of PF2 in this regard is that the game stays balanced and tense even into high levels.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="ronaldsf, post: 8184234, member: 6672921"] After having run a Level 20 short adventure with players who had several months of experience with PF2, I will say that there is a LOT to choose compared to other systems: -Ancestry, Heritage, 5 ancestry feats -Background -Class (and subclass if any) -10 or 11 class feats -5 general feats -10 Skill increases -10 skill feats -4 ability boosts each at L1, L5, L10, L15, L20 -6 starting magic items plus 20,000gp extra to spend -Spellcasters getting ~33 cantrips+spells to use But it would still be an academic exercise, because actually PLAYING a Level 20 character is what tripped players up. There were many, many options for their 3 actions and they only touched perhaps 30 percent of them in the course of 7 sessions. And there were many feats that modified how their basic abilities worked and/or triggered in response to events. They just didn't have the opportunity to organically "learn" their character over the course of 20 levels of play, and the fact that you grow horizontally with more options as you level up in PF2 (versus just getting numerical boosts and enhancements to your main actions/activities) means that you have a wealth of options but don't really know how to use them. And if you choose to carefully consider what you do every turn, play slows down to a crawl if you lack those 20 levels of actual play experience. [URL='https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aUQAPC0p7PkoeN6WZT0gLNyDrik-lmAm/view?usp=sharing']Here is a link to my personal GM "cheat sheet" to manage that adventure[/URL] I'm not sure what you'd want to get out of making Level 20 characters when learning a new system: you enjoy character creation? Or you want to see what high-level play looks like perhaps? Quick character creation is not what you'll get with PF2! The strength of PF2 in this regard is that the game stays balanced and tense even into high levels. [/QUOTE]

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