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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 8202617" data-attributes="member: 12731">Yes, we quickly discarded the warpriest. First, the 3E Bard should have taught Paizo that a &quot;balanced&quot; gish isn't 50%/50% or even 75%/75%. It feels balanced when the sum of your two sides is more like 180% than 100%. After all you can't do both at the same time.Second, the idea of a Warpriest doesn't work together with the idea of a &quot;full Cleric&quot;. The full Divine spell list means you will quickly realize casting spells is better than making attacks. All your physical offense is wasted, while any physical defense quickly becomes OP (why play a frail cleric if you can play a strong cleric and still cast the same spells?) And so we're back to the design work needed to make gishes work...At the very least, they could have tried the 3E Sorcerer path. Being a full level behind in spellcasting (Fireballs at level 6, not 5) was incredibly impopular but actually worked to balance the class. Just being at -2 DC does not work. Either it's just unfun or it can be minmaxed away (by building a character that doesn't cast offensive magic).A Warpriest that mostly bashes heads in is fine, but it needs a different set of magic abilities than a full Cleric. (In other words, it's a Paladin/Champion...!)</blockquote>

[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 8202617, member: 12731"] Yes, we quickly discarded the warpriest. First, the 3E Bard should have taught Paizo that a "balanced" gish isn't 50%/50% or even 75%/75%. It feels balanced when the sum of your two sides is more like 180% than 100%. After all you can't do both at the same time. Second, the idea of a Warpriest doesn't work together with the idea of a "full Cleric". The full Divine spell list means you will quickly realize casting spells is better than making attacks. All your physical offense is wasted, while any physical defense quickly becomes OP (why play a frail cleric if you can play a strong cleric and still cast the same spells?) And so we're back to the design work needed to make gishes work... At the very least, they could have tried the 3E Sorcerer path. Being a full level behind in spellcasting (Fireballs at level 6, not 5) was incredibly impopular but [B]actually worked[/B] to balance the class. Just being at -2 DC does not work. Either it's just unfun or it can be minmaxed away (by building a character that doesn't cast offensive magic). A Warpriest that mostly bashes heads in is fine, but it needs a different set of magic abilities than a full Cleric. (In other words, it's a Paladin/Champion...!) [/QUOTE]

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