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<blockquote data-quote="Hrothgar Rannúlfr" data-source="post: 4119383" data-attributes="member: 54436">There would have to be a lot of other changes, I'm sure.&nbsp; But, if I understand 4E (and I'm not saying that I do), 4E is using that basic formula.&nbsp; So, the 4E fighter will only have a a point or two more of a bonus to hit than the wizard at 20th in 4E.&nbsp; I actually think it will only be +1, excluding feats and exploits (and I really hope I'm wrong).My fighters have access to homebrewed feats that make weapons more interesting.&nbsp; And, since they have access to more feats (and feats wizards can't get), it would work out.&nbsp; Especially, with what I believe Monte's BOXM2 will have for fighters.To fix the math, I believe a designer would have to start with fixing BAB and saves and work out from there.&nbsp; That's why the 3X system is broken and why the progression needed to be changed for epic levels to &quot;work&quot; (and I use the term &quot;work&quot; loosely).&nbsp; I believe this is why we haven't seen a BAB or save progression for 4E... There isn't one.&nbsp; It's just level divided by 2 plus a class bonus between zero and two.&nbsp; I'm not saying it's optimal, but it will stay closer to being balanced at every level than 3X does.The major problem with using this idea in 3x is that everything would have to be re-worked.&nbsp; That's a job for a professional game designer who loves DnD.&nbsp; Not an RPG player, like me, who likes to figure out why the design is a certain way and use it to build little things for his own use.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hrothgar Rannúlfr, post: 4119383, member: 54436"] There would have to be a lot of other changes, I'm sure. But, if I understand 4E (and I'm not saying that I do), 4E is using that basic formula. So, the 4E fighter will only have a a point or two more of a bonus to hit than the wizard at 20th in 4E. I actually think it will only be +1, excluding feats and exploits (and I really hope I'm wrong). My fighters have access to homebrewed feats that make weapons more interesting. And, since they have access to more feats (and feats wizards can't get), it would work out. Especially, with what I believe Monte's BOXM2 will have for fighters. To fix the math, I believe a designer would have to start with fixing BAB and saves and work out from there. That's why the 3X system is broken and why the progression needed to be changed for epic levels to "work" (and I use the term "work" loosely). I believe this is why we haven't seen a BAB or save progression for 4E... There isn't one. It's just level divided by 2 plus a class bonus between zero and two. I'm not saying it's optimal, but it will stay closer to being balanced at every level than 3X does. The major problem with using this idea in 3x is that everything would have to be re-worked. That's a job for a professional game designer who loves DnD. Not an RPG player, like me, who likes to figure out why the design is a certain way and use it to build little things for his own use. [/QUOTE]

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