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Message: <blockquote data-quote="eriktheguy" data-source="post: 5067381" data-attributes="member: 83662">Mmkay, well I do think that the controller ranger is a worth while project for flavor purposes (although OCD is a good reason too). The current ranger powers are nice, they often target multiple foes for controller like tendencies.When I think of Aragorn holding off 9 Nazgul, it makes me think of a controller.It makes sense to continue to allow the player to choose their build option (two weapon, ranged, etc) as you have. Losing the quarry damage will be the sacrifice they make for their controller powers.I also like how you are preserving the ranger's 'quarry' ability but using it for control rather than damage. I would do it as a build option (separate from the build option rangers get normally).One issue with the feats you use, they stack. Currently your rangers get an extra debuff per encounter for each feat they spend on their quarry ability, which makes the feat too good. Rangers with this build will take all of these feats before other options. Compare this to divine classes with 'channel divinity'. They have decent encounter skills they can get access to with a feat, but they are limited to one 'channel divinity' per fight overall. Similarly your ranger could get a certain limitation on the number of debuffs it can apply, and spending feats increases the ranger's options rather than increasing how many times it can apply debuffs.So far the debuffs you offer are fairly good, and split up well into different tiers. I don't think it is broken, you might be able to afford to let the player use these debuffs multiple times per combat.One issue with ranger as a controller is that controllers target multiple foes, while rangers only have one quarry.Here is my thought:The ranger is a striker-controller combination. It works by choosing a single, tough target as its quarry, while helping to eliminate other weak targets from the battle. Whenever the ranger kills an enemy, it regains the ability to debuff a target. By eliminating weak enemies, and debuffing more dangerous enemies, the ranger uses battlefield control to protect the party.Example, your party is ambused by goblins, and an ogre is approaching. In turn 1 you use careful attack to slow the ogre and keep it away for an additional turn. You move beside the goblins and put your bow away. In turn two the ogre is 4 squares closer and no longer slowed. You use twin-strike to take down a goblin minion or two, recharging your debuff. Meanwhile the party's defender moves in on the ogre. In turn 3 the defender is hurt, you rush to his aid, dazing the ogre with another twin strike.My only problem is that this gives the ranger a debuff aprox. once every 2 turns (assuming he has minions to kill) or maybe a bit less. I don't know if this is balanced with giving up the 1d6 damage a turn.PS: do you think deafened is much weaker than slow/prone/daze?PPS: maybe the ranger should get one of these feats for free by default (so that he has at least one option), and can then buy others (again, like channel divinity)PPPS: thanks for letting me stomp all over your ideaEDIT: forgot to mention, my idea for recharging the debuff on a successful kill was to replace PRIME SHOT. Inspired by your idea to replace prime shot.</blockquote>

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