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Perception vs Investigation
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<blockquote data-quote="iserith" data-source="post: 6580747" data-attributes="member: 97077"><p>Sure, I think it's supposed to be ruled on a case-by-base basis and will vary based on the situation and the DM.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Where does it say the bolded? I've just reread the section a couple of times and damn if I don't see it. Maybe I missed it?</p><p></p><p>As for "Search a room for treasure," that's covered by "However, a character not watching for danger can do one of the following activities instead, <strong>or some other activity with the DM’s permission.</strong>"</p><p></p><p>This makes it a trade-off: Either you're watching out for danger and making use of that sweet, sweet passive Perception score you invested in or you're doing something else. For those concerned about passive Perception being overused and too powerful, there's the answer.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The section on ability checks says that an ability check is called for only when there is uncertainty as to the outcome as determined by the DM. If the DM decides you're surprised based on his or her reading of the situation, then you're surprised. So this will vary DM to DM and situation to situation under the same DM.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That is your ruling. Other DMs may rule differently and be equally right as far as that goes. I can't speak for how your players react to things except to say mine don't act that way because we share an understanding about how Perception works and they trust my reading of the context of the situation.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The quote of mine you're replying to specifically says "meaningful decisions <em>during play</em>." Of course pumping Perception comes with an opportunity cost. But my position is that once in play, it's not "always on." If you do anything else other than watch for dangers, you risk not detecting them.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It feels like a gotcha because it lacks context and because your "Sorry..." quote seems to imply that the DM assumes that the players aren't doing anything else. I assume that the characters are always on the lookout for hidden threats unless they have chosen to do something that is distracting them.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="iserith, post: 6580747, member: 97077"] Sure, I think it's supposed to be ruled on a case-by-base basis and will vary based on the situation and the DM. Where does it say the bolded? I've just reread the section a couple of times and damn if I don't see it. Maybe I missed it? As for "Search a room for treasure," that's covered by "However, a character not watching for danger can do one of the following activities instead, [B]or some other activity with the DM’s permission.[/B]" This makes it a trade-off: Either you're watching out for danger and making use of that sweet, sweet passive Perception score you invested in or you're doing something else. For those concerned about passive Perception being overused and too powerful, there's the answer. The section on ability checks says that an ability check is called for only when there is uncertainty as to the outcome as determined by the DM. If the DM decides you're surprised based on his or her reading of the situation, then you're surprised. So this will vary DM to DM and situation to situation under the same DM. That is your ruling. Other DMs may rule differently and be equally right as far as that goes. I can't speak for how your players react to things except to say mine don't act that way because we share an understanding about how Perception works and they trust my reading of the context of the situation. The quote of mine you're replying to specifically says "meaningful decisions [I]during play[/I]." Of course pumping Perception comes with an opportunity cost. But my position is that once in play, it's not "always on." If you do anything else other than watch for dangers, you risk not detecting them. It feels like a gotcha because it lacks context and because your "Sorry..." quote seems to imply that the DM assumes that the players aren't doing anything else. I assume that the characters are always on the lookout for hidden threats unless they have chosen to do something that is distracting them. [/QUOTE]
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