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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ashrym" data-source="post: 7645811" data-attributes="member: 6750235">Sounds like people over-value charm person, tbh.  Charm person shifts the attitude towards friendly and grants advantage on checks but it doesn't allow for anything that a persuasion check would not, and vice versa.  This is true because charm person is using persuasion checks so it's impossible to disassociate the end results from one another as more or less effective.A persuasion check on a friendly NPC with any source of advantage would be equally effective.  The conversation reaction table gives the generalization for DC's 0, 10, and 20 on friendly, indifferent, or hostile.  DC 20 is the highest DC listed and does the following...Friendly -- the creature accepts a significant risk or sacrifice to do as asked.Indifferent -- the creature accepts a minor risk or sacrifice to do as asked.Hostile -- the creature does as asked so long as no risks or sacrifices are involved.Ability check / skill resolution for a requested action has never changed.  The first thing a DM does is determine if the action automatically succeeds or is impossible and automatically fails.  That hasn't changed from the use of any check and is the failsafe against "jumping to the moon" attempts.  As a DM, say no if it's too much.If a check is warranted, decide the attitude towards the party.  Charmed individuals are automatically friendly to the charmer.  Most individuals are likely to be indifferent but players do have the ability to make and foster contacts and I think DM's should facilitate that option.  It creates roleplay opportunities outside of combat and enables the favor system "you'll owe me" type scenarios down the road.A DC 10 for minor risk favors from friendly contacts is pretty easy for any character, tbh.The only real issue is what constitutes levels of risk.  "I could lose my job" or "my wife will leave me" type stuff is a major risk.  This doesn't need to be physical danger.  The repercussions of the actions requested can automatically indicate the level of risk.  Giving the PC's a place to sleep in exchange for work instead of paying is no real risk.  Borrowing a horse might be a minor risk to one person and a major risk to another depending of if they can afford to have the horse never return.  I ask myself "what is the worst case scenario for the person being asked to do something" and that usually gives me an idea where to go from there.Hope that helps.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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