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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Staffan" data-source="post: 8418651" data-attributes="member: 907">Come to think of it, I think part of my possibly irrational rage at skill DCs comes from this:Combat values in Pathfinder 2 are tightly controlled, and not really subject to a lot of player choice. You get your proficiency rank from your class, add a level-appropriate item bonus, and an ability bonus, and that's that. You can be pretty damn sure that a combat-focused level 11 character will have an attack bonus of +22: +15 expert proficiency, +5 stat, +2 item (OK, add +2 for a fighter, but that's sort of their "extra damage" mechanic – barbarians hit harder, fighters hit and crit more often). So you can balance a level 11 creature around that, with a typical AC of 31. AC is similar, with a bit more class variance, but still to the point where you can be pretty certain what AC a combat-based character would have just based on class and level, and to some degree you can use that as part of class balance (e.g. barbarians have worse AC, particularly when raging, but more hp and hit harder).Skills have a lot more variance, because you only get so many skill increases. So there's no way to tell if a level 11 character would be trained, expert, or master in a particular skill. That means that when you design the game, you need to decide where to put the baseline: trained or specialist. I think the game would have been more fun if the baseline was someone who was trained in a skill, and allowed the specialist to reach beyond that – possibly in ways other than just skill bonus (e.g. how Repair repairs more damage if you have a higher proficiency, or how Treat Wounds opens up higher DCs that let you heal more). But instead, they chose to make the specialist the baseline, and punish those who try to do things they don't specialize in.Some examples of how it could be done with the examples I used above:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Recall Knowledge: learn one fact per proficiency rank.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Identify Magic: this is a bit harder to have rank-based benefits in the skill use itself, but the skill feat Quick Identification is nice in that it cuts down the time needed based on rank.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Repair: Already repairs more hp per rank.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Disable Device: Require multiple successes, and higher ranks gets you more "hits" per actual success. So someone Trained in Thievery could still have a good chance of picking a Superior lock but they'd require the full 6 successful rolls, while an Expert could do it in 3 and a Master or Legend in 2 (this would likely require some fiddling with the number of successes required).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Lingering composition could just base the additional duration on Perform ranks.</li> </ul></blockquote>

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